F Chord

Discussion in 'Lessons & Techniques' started by troutnut787, Jul 9, 2013.

  1. Biddlin

    Biddlin Well-Known Member

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    Old time jazz guitarists, like Barney Kessel, use a multitude of substitutions and partial chords when "faking" and "vamping", until it becomes instinct .
    Want to really p!$$ one off, ask him to name one of his passing chords from the middle of a vamp.
    This, btw is where theory really helps, bootlegging another thread on another forum where anyone who knows figured bass (dbb & me apparently) is immediately suspect. Knowing the relationship between notes and harmony is like the answer book to 90% of the chord questions you'll ever have. Intuition is good, too. Of course, practice cures all ills.
    Biddlin ;>)/
     
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  2. Sootio

    Sootio Well-Known Member

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    There's also "ghosting". Hit the bottom notes first, and that gives your other fingers a little time to get in place.
     
  3. sgtbeefheart

    sgtbeefheart Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I do that, and the "substitution" has come in handy recently,
    as my friends' music is "interesting", and they use chords I never use.

    I could play the chords, but I couldn't easily jump from one to the other,
    so I used parts of the chords I do use, and they didn't sound out of place.

    It shows that even if, like myself, you haven't studied technique or theory,
    and been, well, lazy, if you've been playing long enough, you have lots of
    hidden or subconscious knowledge that surfaces when you're out of your
    comfort zone.
     
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  4. sgtbeefheart

    sgtbeefheart Well-Known Member

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    I have a similar problem, in that after all these years, my main bending
    finger (ring finger) has gotten so flat and wide, it encroaches on other strings in a chord.
     
  5. Biddlin

    Biddlin Well-Known Member

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    For the academically inclined, or those who want to play a "Hot" blues and jazz style, the recently passed, Mickey Baker's method and chord books are great tools. If you don't know who Mickey is, listen to his 1956 hit,"Love is Strange" with Sylvia Robinson.( founder of Sugar Hill records and arguably the mother of hip-hop) Mickey influenced almost every R&B, jazz and rock guitar player of the era. [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LDpI063qBA]Mickey and Sylvia - Love Is Strange - YouTube[/ame]
    Biddlin ;>)/
     
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  6. dbb

    dbb Well-Known Member

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    The old Mickey Baker books...I got my copies, and they look like yours! use, wear, age....and I don't have the "Easy Chord Guitar System" volume.

    I swear for a while it seemed that when any rock or blues players knew some cool jazzy chord voicings they got them from that book!
     
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  7. Biddlin

    Biddlin Well-Known Member

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    I met Mickey through a mutual friend back in the late seventies . He was making a rare visit to the US to settle some legal matter. I met him over a cup of coffee as he instinctively picked up the strat from the couch and noodled on some diminished runs as he spoke. He laughed when I told him about buying his books at college bookstore in Berkeley and said, "I made a lot more from those books than I ever did playin'." He seemed a very nice, humble guy.
    Biddlin ;>)/
    Biddlin
     
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  8. sgtbeefheart

    sgtbeefheart Well-Known Member

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    I may have seen that Jazz Guitar book in '67.

    The guy who was lead guitar in my first band had a Mickey Baker
    jazz guitar book, and I guess it could have been that one.

    We met playing football, he was on the opposition's left wing, I
    was on our right wing.

    We didn't play much football, just spent the whole game talking
    about the Blues.

    I walked five miles there and back carrying my Kay Jazz 2 to his house
    every night for weeks.

    How new and exciting it all was then, and I still haven't heard a better
    guitar player than him.
     
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  9. Karathas

    Karathas Well-Known Member

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    Hey i do that :) Didn't know it had a name
     
  10. LeadFinger

    LeadFinger Well-Known Member

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    I love the cowboy F now; it has a nice ring to it. But it was a real PIA at first. Don't be discouraged: I picked up a guitar for the first time in 30 years and got it after a month or so, so it is possible. I can grab that chord on my vintage frets, jumbos or mediums now.

    If you go with the full "old school" 5-string fretted version, you can also use that shape to get some reedy 5-string chord voicings down the board. Or, hit the open low E occasionally for an interesting barrage while playing those chords. (Especially if you tune it down.) As for tips...

    Let's see. Get your fingers over the fretboard by positioning your thumb correctly, then avoid death grip. You really don't need as much pressure as you might think. What you do need is to develop a bit of callous spread to the tippy part of your index finger. Playing power chords on your bass helps with that, too, let me tell you.

    It's all worth it, since once you have that down you can use your new power fun finger for other chords that require fretting those two strings, some of which are a bigger PIA since you have to grab the low E with your thumb, at the same time. It also comes in handy when barreing three strings to make a one-finger cowboy A, so long as you can bend that first joint in your finger.

    The barre B that iblive mentions was a rube goldberg contraption for me until I got my pinky good and rough, and bendy. Now I just barre the D,G,B with my pinky, leaving the little E to ring out.

    In general, I find that barre chords are 90% positioning. A tiny difference in the way you position your finger (or finger part) makes for bliss or buzz. But you will miss that if you are using too much pressure. I have nerve damage so I can't use too much pressure or I experience pain. This is a real incentive to develop a light touch.
     
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  11. WavMixer

    WavMixer Well-Known Member

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    Alas I too am new to barre chords and I also struggle with the barre F. I find it helpful to have my index finger slightly on the side so that my finger nail is towards the nut. Also I keep the first joint of my index finger above the fretboard so that just below the second section of my index finger covers the low E. Not sure if this makes sense, but it works for me.
     
  12. Kerry Brown

    Kerry Brown Well-Known Member

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    When I decided to take up the guitar again I looked for all my old books. The only one I could find was Mickey Baker Book 1. So far I've been afraid to tackle it. I remember my struggles with it from 30 years ago. I do still remember the theory and ideas in it but fretting the chords, not a chance. It took me years to get through that book. I never did buy the 2nd one. Figured it would be beyond my patience. Mine is a bit newer than yours because the price on mine is $1.95.
     
  13. donepearce

    donepearce Well-Known Member

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    I've made a small youtube vid of how I play F chords in barre. The second one - what you might call the C shape - I really hate the sound of and I never use it.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RckdlZCGZdw&list=UUmIrlZEmlS8DaVoGWpDN9nA"]Barre F chord - YouTube[/ame]
     
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  14. eS.G.

    eS.G. Well-Known Member

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    Thank GOD for Barre Chords...... :)
    nice vid Don.
    Cheers
     
  15. WavMixer

    WavMixer Well-Known Member

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    Beautiful inlays! What guitar is that?
     
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  16. JohnnyGoo

    JohnnyGoo Well-Known Member

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    Id guess a PRS
     
  17. donepearce

    donepearce Well-Known Member

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    And you'd be right
     
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  18. CATMANDUE

    CATMANDUE Well-Known Member

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    If you get that F down, you will have a bunch of other chords by sliding your chord on higher on the neck. F# G G# A A# etc. Next learn the barred B major on the second fret. I remember that one being a bitch as well! Same thing when you slide it up higher C C# D D# E F F# etc. Make sure all your notes ring out. Have someone who KNOWS!!! check how your action is. If you got crummy action this can discourage you from properly learning. I want to encourage you to keep trying to learn! There is always something new to the guitar it seems.
     
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  19. WavMixer

    WavMixer Well-Known Member

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    I actually prefer the barred B over the barred F. However for what I've been playing lately it's been using a barred B minor. Been working on learning a new song that forced me to learn the barred B minor and get to become friends :naughty:
     
  20. oldleftySG

    oldleftySG Active Member

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    Also- make sure your nut is cut correctly to give you the lowest action at the first fret. If the nut slots are on the high side it makes the first fret stuff even more difficult.
     
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