Loss of treble when decreasing volume 2017 standard T and ...

Discussion in 'Gibson SG' started by cigblues3, Aug 29, 2017.

  1. cigblues3

    cigblues3 Member

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    As the title states, I am losing treble when I decrease the volume. Also, the knob is super sensitive at 7 and above. I can live with it, since I love the guitar. But if there is a fix, I would appreciate some input. Please chime in.
     
  2. DCCable

    DCCable Active Member

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    Install a treble bleed network on the volume pot(s) of the guitar. If they are 500 K pots something like a 120pf cap paralleled with a 1/4 watt 470K resistor between the hot side of the pot and the wiper works very well for this.
     
  3. Chubbles

    Chubbles Well-Known Member

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    Agreed, treble bleed is what you need!

    Hey, that rhymed!
     
  4. plankton

    plankton Well-Known Member

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    Yep, treble bleed, there's a few different methods, a web search or even just a search on this forum will turn them up. Personally I opted for the Kinman version which has a resistor and cap in series.
     
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  5. donepearce

    donepearce Well-Known Member

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    Hello all - I'm back.

    Yes a treble bleed will work. But how long is your guitar lead? It's the capacitance of that which is causing the treble loss as you turn down. If you could do with a shorter lead, the problem would be lessened.
     
    kiko, Gahr and Biddlin like this.
  6. jvin248

    jvin248 Active Member

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    .

    Here's what you need to know: http://guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/5317/treble-bleed-circuit

    EVH put a 'tone' knob on his Frankenstrat's volume pot 'because when you turn it down the tone changes'.

    Some try to solve it with 1950s wiring but then find that turning the tone knob changes the volume! Treble bleed is the best solution.

    .
     
  7. syscokid

    syscokid Well-Known Member

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    Ironically, this is one of the reasons I like this style of wiring. Especially with humbuckers.
     
  8. cigblues3

    cigblues3 Member

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    Any fix for the volume knob being so sensitive. From 7 to 10, there is a huge difference.
     
  9. syscokid

    syscokid Well-Known Member

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    I'm assuming your guitar is stock. Are both volume controls doing this?

    I'm not an enthusiastic fan of the cap parallel with a resistor for a treble bleed mod, but the resistor in that circuit might smooth out the taper of the volume control.

     
  10. cigblues3

    cigblues3 Member

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    Thanks for all the replies. I'll soon have the part installed.
     
  11. DCCable

    DCCable Active Member

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    Exactly, that's why I recommended it, it does change the pot taper for the better.
     
  12. plankton

    plankton Well-Known Member

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    As others mentioned, some treble bleed circuits will affect that. You can also try pots with a different taper. Audio taper pots will have that swell effect near the top of their range but you can get ones that either spread it out more or tighten it up. There's always linear taper pots as well which will give you a constant taper all the way.
     
  13. gball

    gball Well-Known Member

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    Doesn't the 2017 have a circuit board? I've never opened mine up to verify but I think they do. How hard is it to do the treble bleed mod on a circuit board-equipped guitar?
     
  14. cigblues3

    cigblues3 Member

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    This seems to be a frequent problem. Do all 2017 standard Ts do this?
     
  15. VetPsychWars

    VetPsychWars Well-Known Member

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    You'd need more than average experience to do it. You'd have to tack the leads directly to the pot legs, and likely need to pull the circuit board to do it.

    Take your 1000pf capacitor and mount your 220 resistor to it. Snug them up and solder together. Then you need to sleeve the leads of the assembly, tin the ends, tin the pot terminals, and tack it on.

    Tom
     
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  16. cigblues3

    cigblues3 Member

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    Thanks for all the replies. I have my answer...keep the volume up and pick softly when called for!
     
  17. rotorhead

    rotorhead Well-Known Member

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    Mine doesnt. No issues at all (so far)
     
  18. Col Mustard

    Col Mustard Well-Known Member

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    this thread is an example of this forum at its best... lots of great info offered,
    no bickering or name calling and the OP gets to make up his own mind after
    reading through many opinions.

    Many players end up replacing the whole wiring harness, getting rid of the
    PCB and installing high quality components that will give a smooth curve all
    the way from 0-11. This (or installation of a treble bleed pot) will void your warranty. Not a good idea on a new guitar, unless it's unbearable.

    Therefore, I agree with your idea to keep the guitar stock and play it with
    personal dynamics, altering your volume that way. There are other options
    besides surgery. How about a volume pedal? Such that you control your voume
    by increasing it with the pedal rather than decreasing it with the knob?

    Likewise, an EQ pedal will cost less than a wiring replacement job, and give
    you complete control over your tone, as well as providing a clean boost or
    pad. It's worth a try, because the EQ pedal is very useful for many situations
    ...not just this one.

    And, you can always re-wire the guitar with a high quality harness later,
    after your warranty expires... if the problem persists or you can't figure out what else to do. Owning a volume pedal and an EQ pedal will increase your choices, so I don't think either of them is wasted effort.
     
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  19. Col Mustard

    Col Mustard Well-Known Member

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    also, it's a very personal matter of style, how you control your volume
    AND your tone in mid song. I know players who are very good at the little
    finger routine, I watch them do it, with great effect and it boggles my mind.

    I couldn't do it. I like to control things with my foot... and my personal
    style has evolved in that direction. So I usually keep my volumes set with
    my bridge p'up on 11 and my neck p'up on about 8. Pick up my guitar, tune
    it with a stomp tuner, then stomp the tuner and I'm live. Use the EQ pedal as
    a clean boost, and the Blues Driver as a dirty one.
    electric pedal board 2017.jpg
    So my use of the pots is a lot more static. But having a smooth curve from 0-11
    is important to me. Good luck in your quest for tone. The Quest for Tone has
    no finish line, so it's technically a Death March...
     
    lcw likes this.

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