Pink Neck Binding?

Discussion in 'Vintage SG' started by Steve D, Apr 8, 2019.

?

Did vintage SGs get pink neck binding?

  1. Heck yeah, all the time. That's just the way it was.

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. Occasionally but it wasn't all that common.

    3 vote(s)
    60.0%
  3. What are you talking about? No way!

    2 vote(s)
    40.0%
  1. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    In another thread we were discussing the how modern reissues by the custom shop prior to 2007 had a tendancy to have the "historically correct" analine dye bleed onto the neck binding, turning it pink. See a pick below of the binding on my 2006 SG historic reissue for an example of what I'm taking about.

    I've seen places that claim this is historically accurate, old vintage guitars have this going on. When I had a vintage SG it absolutely did not have this going on. But that's a small sample size. So I'm wondering, oh vintage SG owners, is this truly a historically accurate effect? What say ye?

     
  2. cerebral gasket

    cerebral gasket Well-Known Member

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    What I see in the above photo is the finish color bleeding into the binding.

    I currently have or had guitars in the past where the finish color bleeds into the binding and some that do not. Whether this phenomenon is considered a manufacturing defect or not is debatable.

    1963 SG Special
    (no finish bleeding)

    [​IMG]

    2001 SG Standard Korina
    (yellow finish bleeding)

    [​IMG]

    2006 SG Classic
    (no finish bleeding)

    [​IMG]

    I have also seen cream binding that looks pink to my eyes on finished and unfinished guitars as well which is a complete different story from the finish color bleeding into the binding.

    2011 LP Traditional Pro 50's
    (cream/pink binding, no finish bleeding)

    [​IMG]

    Unknown
    (cream/pink binding, no finish bleeding)

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2019
  3. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    That last picture with the cream binding does look pink which is weird on an unfinished neck. I think mine is definitely an fake aged yellowish thing though, the top is that without a hint of red. But the sides, you see one of them in the photo, very very red.

    Your Korina is interesting. In the picture it looks so uniform that it almost seems intentional, like they wanted the binding to match the neck. Any chance of that? Or if you look elsewhere on the binding it's white in spots so there's no chance of that?
     
  4. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    By the way, Gibson themselves said that the pink thing was normal in vintage instruments. Here's a shot of one of the inserts in a Custom Shop historic reissue from before 2007 (when they changed the dyes).

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    A great thing about reverb is that you can look at lots and lots of examples of vintage guitars that you can never inspect in person. So I went and looked at SGs from 1965 and 1961 (checked sold listings, there are more than currently selling ones). You do see some finish bleed into the binding but man, it's slight. Like a pinstriping of the base is all I saw. Like this example from 1961. So small an ammount, nothing like these new recreations.

    Looking at this, I vaugely can recall that I think mine probably had some of this going on too. But it barely registered because it was just at the connection and only like two molecules deep.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2019
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  6. papagayo

    papagayo Well-Known Member

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    The binding is white like snow on your SG Classic, is it the same for all years?

    @Steve D , What case came with your Gibson?
     
  7. cerebral gasket

    cerebral gasket Well-Known Member

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    Both my 2004 and 2006 SG Classics have white binding.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2019
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  8. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    The case is the original Gibson Custom case. It fits the guitar almost too perfectly, it's so snug I feel like if I took it in and out a lot it would wear down the finish on the edges.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  9. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    That makes sense thought, right? That is, mine is VOS which uses archaic finishing materials while yours would use the more modern one.

    Personally I think the binding bleed comes down to Gibson cutting corners on time. When you do a nitro finish your supposed to let it cure for quite a while before you pull it out and finish it off. My guess is that in the 60s they did that, now they try to shave some time off and it results in the finish not being as cured and ultimately bleeding into the surrounding material. That's my theory anyway.
     
  10. DrBGood

    DrBGood Well-Known Member

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    Maybe my understanding of the word bleeding is different, because all the blleeding I see here looks more like bad taping or bad cleaning. Bleeding to me is a color that spreads because it either was too liquid (a technique bad watercolorist use) or the material it bled on was porous.

    Look at this one. Bottom red line seem more like tape was put too high and the bottom of the binding has been sprayed with red stain. Between nut and binding, it pretty much looks like leftover from a bad cleaning job, a bit like food between your teeth.

    [​IMG]
    As for cerebral gasket's Korina, I seem to remember that there was a yellow stain applied on the wood. So it would be an over spray because binding wasn't taped, but not bleeding after the fact. Am I seeing this wrong ?

    As for vintage pink binding, I'd bet that it's in the nature of the plastic they used. Some got a pinkish hue as they aged, some got a yellow hue. But bleeding ? Once a dye/stain is dry, the only way I see it bleeding onto something else, would be to have a strong chemical dilute it.
     
  11. cerebral gasket

    cerebral gasket Well-Known Member

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    While the last sentence in that disclaimer pictured earlier states that the migration of the dye should not be considered a defect of materials or workmanship, I still call BS on that because I posted examples of both vintage and modern guitars where that does not occur.

    That’s why I say it’s debatable and it’s really up to the customer if they choose to accept that or not. No one is being forced to purchase guitars with that feature and I believe it may only be a disclaimer to prevent returns for warranty purposes.

    I agree that in the OP photo it looks more like overspray than it does “migration of the dye”.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2019
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  12. Chubbles

    Chubbles Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if the pink is on the surface or completely through the binding. I assume if it was on the surface, they would remove it. I guess that answers my question.
     
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  13. cerebral gasket

    cerebral gasket Well-Known Member

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    One way to find out is to send one of these guitars with "migration of the dye" out to a pro shop and have them scrape the binding and re-shoot it with clear.
     
  14. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    I've never watched them build a guitar but I don't think it would make a lot of sense to put the finishing touches on it BEFORE you spray on the dyes and nitro. Further, nitro doesn't "Dry" it cures and it takes forever and ever to do so. To the touch it feels dry really soon after you spray it but it's not really stable and typically youd want to set it aside to cure for a long time. Weeks or longer. I suspect Gibson let the nitro finish cure longer in the 60s than they do today. If so, i could certainly see some migration onto nearby porous surfaces as a possibility. But I'm no chemist or finishing expert. Just someone who thinks if the custom shop accidentally sprayed a bunch of cherry dye onto the binding they would fix that and not sell it that way.

    We are pretty much in agreement though that the old vintage ones don't seem to suffer from this affect, at least to the extent that the early 2000s VOS ones did.
     
  15. Chuteboxehero

    Chuteboxehero Active Member

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    Just checked my 74 standard and although the neck isn't bound, the white dot fret markers that are where the binding would be have turned pink.
     
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  16. AngelDeVille

    AngelDeVille Well-Known Member

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    Finally! Something I care less about than multi-piece bodies!
     
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  17. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    Interesting. Thanks. Confirms it is indeed something older SGs faced.
     
  18. Steve D

    Steve D Well-Known Member

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    Sorry it distracted you from topics you dislike less.
     
  19. cerebral gasket

    cerebral gasket Well-Known Member

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    The yellow tint on the binding is uniform and does look intentional. The side of the nut is yellow like they were trying to blend it in with the finish color. I usually prefer white binding on guitars that have it, but this one is an exception. It doesn't bother me at all because I really like the natural korina finish and the fat 50's rounded neck is such a treat to play. While I really favor my SG Classics, this Korina SG Standard is pretty much my dream SG.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2019
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  20. Paul G.

    Paul G. Well-Known Member

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    1. It happened.

    2. It was common, although not universal.

    3. Either way is possible on a vintage guitar, other factors should be used for authentication.

    4. It is what it is, if you stress about it, or have an opinion, I feel you could put your neurons to better use.
     
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