SG with Bigsby B7

Discussion in 'Gibson SG' started by dovosk, Jan 7, 2012.

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  1. likea45

    likea45 Well-Known Member

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    I don't need a ton of tremolo in what I'm doing. I use it for a few songs and it works great...if I was truly in need of heavy tremolo or wanted to do dive bombs, I wouldn't turn to a stetsbar that's what Floyds are for...I think they are both god awful looking wether they function well or not...
    Aesthetics are everything when you first see an instrument then if you can bond with its playability, tone etc you have a winner.
     
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  2. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    No Race Baiters, Bullys or Bigots needed here

    Frankly I am surprised at the anger expressed by some towards me, especially after I have repeatedly made it clear that I own several Bigsbys, think they are Beautiful & acknowledge that they can be played by some without complaint, but that this just hasn't been my experience.

    Then we have Dovosk, A person so insulted by me writing about preferring a Stetsbar & defending what my experience has been through trial & error over my many years of playing on guitars & Bigsbys, that he was compelled to write...
    Really? I don't deserve or warrant that kind of response. Most importantly, I cannot allow you, Dovosk, to even let your disgusting insinuations about race & religion to be mentioned while your comments are being directed towards me in such a manner. That's is over the line & unacceptable behavior. You obviously have no insight into who I am or what I stand for. Your bringing up race & religion in such a reckless manner indicates that you need to back up a couple steps and look at what you did.

    Did anything I wrote warrant such a personal attack? Did I do anything to make anyone feel I held anything negative towards any race or religion? Where did that come from? Me having an opinion that was different from yours? Me talking with experience like I know something & you not liking that? There isnt a good enough reason. Your insinuations disgust me. I feel dirty from even having to address such comments but feel forced to by no one else stepping up & by your mere mentioning such things & trying to attach them to anything that has to do with me. Further insinuation of that kind wont be tolerated & I will do what I need to do to keep them from being perpetuated on these pages.

    Personal attacks and comments that contain inflammatory racial & religious banter can not be ignored or tolerated. There is nobody that knows me as a person who has ever talked to me in such a manner. There would never be a reason to ever say such an off base & inappropriate thing. I guess the respect that people have for me in real life gets lost over the internet where people feel they can say what ever they can make up because they feel emboldened & safe not being face to face with the person. It would be a safe bet that you, Dovosk, would never say such a thing to anybody in person. Why should your words on this forum be any different than the real world? I can't imagine anyone talking like that & saying such things in real life. Over a guitar forum? Really?

    I'm washing my hands of animosity & further request of everyone that we all proceed to conduct ourselves with an air of mutual respect if at all possible or refrain from writing. And that we look to the things that bind us as a group of people & not waste or time & energy being divisive. We are all here to share, learn & grow as well as support each other as guitarists.

    If people cant be respectful of others difference of opinion without being demeaning & insulting then they need to find something to do besides write in anger and poison this forum with such ugliness for all to see. Even those who arent members can read our words and make judgements about us by what is written here. This is a great forum that means a lot to me as well as others. I would love to not have to deal with anybody on this level of behavior but be assured that if people choose to try to insult, degrade, harass or bully others that I personally wont stand for it.

    To help sooth any anger, I Personally apologize to anybody that I may have offended by anything I wrote. I'm not writing anything with the intent to piss anybody off. My only intent was to share my experiences & maybe help somebody along the way. Maybe my humor was misunderstood & I should from now on follow my humor with a (ha ha), lol, or one of the goofy faces of the emocons :applause: so people dont get so offended.

    I guess I stepped on some toes because I talked about personal issues I have with the Bigsby tail piece. I thought that was what this was about. Guitar players talking about guitars & guitar related stuff. I would like to think we can keep stupid, mean & ignorant out of this forum when disagreeing. It is easy enough to disagree without trying to insult others.

    I dont believe this forums intent is to be a format for insulting & offending others who think & feel differently than ourselves. We should all be standing together on this premise as well as be keeping this a safe place to talk about guitars without the fear of somebody race baiting, using religious taunts or trying to bully others. I would really like to think that I am not standing alone on this premise. I would like to think I am not the only person who is able to stand up & say that such hostility has no place here. I would like to believe that other members feel the same way. I would like to think that even you dovosk would feel that way after thinking things over.

    Peace.
     
  3. Hammer

    Hammer Well-Known Member

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    This thread started as one user wanting to show off his B7 install, not a debate on Bigsbys Vs Stetsbars. Start a thread with that topic and, in this thread, stay on topic. It's simple, polite, common sense, considerate internet forum etiquette, man. Do that and all the venom disappears, I guarantee it.
     
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  4. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    And this is where the conversation started & where the offending comments were made. This wasnt about Bigsby (VS) Stetsbar yet I am stuck having to defend it or remain insulted. I dont care to start a thread or argue with people over this crap & I've apologized before about steppin on someones thread (like that matters).

    In addition, (big FYI) this is my first forum membership & I honestly didnt get a forum handbook or guidelines about what to or not to talk about. Seriously, is it written somewhere that I have to droll over somebodys SG with a Bigsby & stay on topic or face race baiting & religious taunting?? Is that what being in a forum is about? I really had no idea I should have started a new thread to talk with who I was talking to about what we were talking about.

    I'm just going to step back until some adult or maybe somebody that took an ethics class in college starts to monitor things & I dont have to be the only person standing up for myself when people get insulting & cross a line that is plain for me too see. You see (maybe not?) that it shouldnt matter what mistakes I make by not staying on topic, it just doesnt give people the right to insult, bait & try to bully. Period. Even if there was rules that said it was ok to do so.
    I am just surprised that I dont see that point being brought up by anybody. Talk about etiquette?

    Well if nothing else, this has exposed some haters & baiters. I'll stand alone against the world if I have to until I am joined by others blessed with a sense of common consideration for others.

    I do appreciate your advice. If I can get out of this thread with a thread of self respect, I promise I wont make the mistake of going off topic on someone thread, even if it aint in no rule book. The rule book of hard knocks yo.
     
  5. Hammer

    Hammer Well-Known Member

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    Meh...people can be keyboard cowboys. You have to shrug it off, man. Unfortunately, that is the nature of the interwebs. If this is indeed your first foray into forumhood, think of it like a normal, in real life conversation. If someone is physically standing there in a room holding up their guitar, proud of their new B7 install, would you walk up and start extolling the virtues of the vibrato system you deem better? I know I wouldn't, simply cuz it's kinda rude.

    As far as rule books, no, there isn't an official forum etiquette rule book, but...a quick Google search will give you a few tidbits to examine. This one is pretty good to start you off.

    How to Use Proper Forum Etiquette | eHow.com

    It basically boils down to, stay on topic, don't be rude and...don't feed the trolls or get your jimmies rustled when they appear.
     
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  6. Biddlin

    Biddlin Well-Known Member

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    As a US citizen with roots going back to the first colonies, I find it most distasteful and embarrassing when a countryman wraps himself in the flag to promote his argument and protect his ego .
     
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  7. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    Thank You. Good points to ponder. I've actually learned a lot about something (forums) that I was rather ignorant about and also gained some insight into todays way of conversing on such a forum. For instance, it is so common to reply in short quippy cleaver one or two liners whos points may be ellusive unless outright obvious like 'wow, nice guitar'. I chalk that up to todays texting culture or like I tell my daughter 'the dumbing down of America'. Which is not meant to be an insult but an honest observation. Sometimes people just want to be happy & bask in the glory of how nice their guitar looks. My bad for not getting that at the time but I did not forsee or want things to devolve into such nonsense. I think that this was one of my first posts, ever.

    Todays way of writing has all served to make our on line conversations short & open to misinterpretation. My college creative writting professor would be flipping over the lost opportunity to express ourselves with words & be understood, never mind creative with our words.

    I'm a different generation than todays kids. duh. lol &:ohno:. Some FYI; I've spent 25 years in prison working for a living & supporting a family so I'm used to a certain element of mutual respect from others, from the Superintendant (Warden) right through to the convict. Comments like Dovosk in that past very real offline life would readily be met with me ready to take it where ever it has to go until respect is given or an apology accepted. Its a simple life but you know where you stand. Almost preferrable because you settled such things & moved on. Problem, confrontation, settlement, mutual respect, the end. I dont know that that type of resolution is possible here. There is nothing but oneself to control our words here.

    Honestly, I didnt think to read ehow about using forums. I did want to be appropriate & fit in & maybe make some new friends I had something in common with. I did however read this site guidelines. It gave no such indication that going off topic on a thread was a bad thing or that replying to such a thing would warrant such unneccessary over the top reaction. It did however say to report abusive & offensive users. Given my background, you could understand why I choose not to report (snitch) but confront like a man the offending party.

    Trolls, lol. That a funny concept for what, ugly hiding under the bridge (thread) waiting to come out & do their thing? lol. Thats good.
     
  8. Tony M

    Tony M Well-Known Member

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    :(
    This is an open request to whoever it is that moderates this forum.

    It would seem obvious that none of the people involved in this "misunderstanding"
    are willing to drop it. The thread has deteriorated into a "last word" contest.

    Please lock the thread before it sinks any lower.


    This is an open request to the people involved.

    If you are unwilling to let this go please continue it via private messages.
    Your public bickering is both insulting and beyond boring at this point.




    PS: The Stetsbar, in my opinion, is still hideous. The fact that it functions
    beautifully in no way changes its visual appearence. Works beautifully and
    looks beautiful are 2 different things. Saying something looks beautiful
    because it works well is the same as saying something works
    well because it looks good. Both statements are nonsense.

    (Those of you who feel that the Stetsbar is not hideous looking
    are right by the way. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.)
     
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  9. smitty_p

    smitty_p Well-Known Member

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    All,

    At the risk of making things worse, I'll simply point out that I began a thread awhile ago, simply to deal with Bigsby tech issues. It is located here:

    http://www.everythingsg.com/forum/luthiers-corner/18640-bigsby-good-bad-ugly.html

    I think Relic61 makes some interesting points, as have some others. The thread I began was intended to take a detached view of the Bigsby, even to the point of discussing its flaws, from a technical perspective. Perhaps, that would be good place to pursue this discussion.
     
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  10. Biddlin

    Biddlin Well-Known Member

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    A well reasoned and respectful thread smitty ! ;>)/
     
  11. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    After re reading my original post, it is obvious I was trying to help those who were questioning weather to put a Bigsby on their SG or not as I was once one of those guys dead set on making my Bigsby B5 work for me because I loved it. Athough lengthy, it explains I'm not simply talkin $hit because 'Bigbys are bad' 'Stetsbar Good' as some would like to simplify & dismiss but that I actually love the way Bigsbys look & feel. I even predicted being turned on for talking about Bigsby shortcomings. How Prophetic.

    Honestly, if you were somebody reading this thread thinking about putting a Bigsby on your guitar, wouldnt you like to know the downside of these things before going through the trouble & exspense? I'd be pissed if all I read about here was everyone loving their Bigsby & I went through the trouble & time putting one on my guitar to find out the limitations & tuning instability.

    Just because I sound like I know what I'm talking about doesnt give warrant to bring race, religion & God into this forum as if to dismiss my information & slander me personally. Can anybody agree to that? So far other members are silent or maybe afraid to talk out that because of the subject matter. What about you Tony M? You always have a lot to say in judgement of others? Has this sunk low enough for you yet? How about some more tap dancing & twisting my words around so you can look like a smart ass at my exspense? Whether its your
    or
    or
    or
    I would suggest that its this type bravoda styled grandstanding that starts the bully ball rolling by trying to find flaw with others, totally misrepresenting them (And If your not talking about me why are you writing as if to imply such things were said by me?) & then talking smack while making yourself look like a big bad smarty pants. Plus, I would add that you obviously dont take the time to fully comprehend what you are reading & in fact you are the one misrepresenting my words & intended meaning when you throw up you short double talking quips that are intended to belittle others & make you look superior. Please, take you're own advice & dont quote me out of context.

    Take the time to look up your own posts in reference to what you say to me as compared elsewhere. Frankly I'm tired of it & I'm calling you out on your conduct toward me. I hope that isnt to insulting or boring for you. It is just time you are made aware of what your persitently negative quips look like to me & contemplate what they may signal to others. I've let them go un checked with the hopes you would stop posting your negative quips in response to my postings. You need to Get off my sack Dude! Find someone else, better yet, dont find someone else to do that too either. Its posturing at somebody elses exspense. You will not be able to do it & go unchecked anymore. Thats who I am. Get to know me. Im really a decent hearted guy that dont take to being messed with. Simple enough.

    Best yet, here is the post by the person who baited me with religious & racial taunts where he himself says Bigsbys have tuning issues..
    All proving my point. I know its typical to mess with the FNG. You just need to get to know me. I'm not going to intentionally mess with or insult anybody, thats not why Im here, but I will tenaciously defend myself & others who are picked on, insulted or bullied. It aint happening. So if you dont want me boring you by pointing out where you crossed the line or insulting your intelligence by defending the integrity of myself & others insulted or slandered here on our forum, Think about what the hell you're writing & how others are going to feel when they read it & what good if any your words will do for others. Although I've been critical of others right here on this thread, you will find I havent done this elsewhere & I dont think I'm off base with my assessment here & do have hopes everyone takes the time to think about all this & move on better for it all. I'm ready so long as people stop talkin smack, been ready. Anybody else care to keep insulting?
     
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  12. Tony M

    Tony M Well-Known Member

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    Relic,
    You are right.
    I am wrong.
    Happy now?
    Goodbye.
    Be well.
    Tony M.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2012
  13. Biddlin

    Biddlin Well-Known Member

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    I had to put on my 3D glasses and nose clip to cope with the Denigration,Denial, Deflection and bovine excrement . A rightly proud fellow forum member displayed his instrument, ingenuity and industry for the enjoyment and elucidation of other members and one seized the opportunity to rant on ad nauseum about the flaws in a component that no one is forcing him to use . Did anyone make such comments on his recently acquired 70s Tribute SG ?
    "There is nothing but oneself to control our words here...It gave no such indication that going off topic on a thread was a bad thing or that replying to such a thing would warrant such unneccessary(sic) over the top reaction. It did however say to report abusive & offensive users. Given my background, you could understand why I choose not to report (snitch) but confront like a man the offending party." :squint:
    So far as I read, there has been one rude, dismissive and chauvinistic poster . While our correctional system is noted for recruiting profoundly free thinkers to rehabilitate its clients, perhaps the effects of institutionalization have desensitized one to the social context in which one operates. Several members expressed their own reservations about Bigsbys, while, rightfully praising another's industry and guile in the modification to HIS instrument, without denigrating his free choice .One might find it well to keep critical comments pithy and praise effusive, otherwise, one might make more friends on MyLesPaul Forum .
     
  14. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    Debating guitars, going off subject or someone defending their right to talk freely, does not necessitate throwing personal insults at each other or trying to belittle and defame someones character. It also doesnt give someone like yourself liscence to make it an opportunity to go after somebody personally and insult them. I cannot believe somebody with such stature as yourself would feel compelled to contribute in such a manner. Maybe your big words are meant to be cleaver and funny but it all comes down to the fact that you are still trying to belittle & insult someone personally & that really has no place on our forum nor is it becoming of someone your age that others happen to look too for example. I now that I personally had respect for you prior to your last two personal shots at somebodys person & character while passing judgement & throwing mockery here for all to read.

    This thread needs to be left to die its miserable fate and walked away from lesson learned. I would have thought you would have understood that. To continue trading insults is by its own not only insulting to everyone but a waste of time & energy for all involved. If you have a complaint with me how about sending me a personal message instead of posting your negative diatribe for everyone to read which is sure to encourage more likewise behavior & most definately bring another response from myself here on this thread in defense of my self, once again. I have better things to do Bidlin than trade insults. I could insinuate things back, throw some insults, but I will choose to keep it real & not resort to the name calling & ugliness but just stay on topic by commenting on what you have been personally doing to me. That by itself is bad enough in my eyes & frankly I am ashamed for you. Dr Jekyll, Mr Bidlin. Who are you. A nice old man or an angry old codger incapable of restraint & kindness? You words speak for themselves and represent who you are when we read them.

    I cant help but feel your words were written to elicit a response so I begrudgingly have. I hope this satisfies your need to roll around in the mud of personal insult that you havent been able to resist engaging me in.

    Once again, my personal apologies to everyone for personally crossing the line. I hope we all can move forward with a little bit more respect for each other & get back to enjoying our forum.

    Dovosk, in case you missed it, I really do think your guitar looks wicked awesome & it was a great mod getting that tailpiece to fit up like that. That was a nice job worth much admiration. Please except my personal apology for getting pulled into the whole Bigsby thing on the thread you started. My bad brother.
     
  15. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    It is to protect his right to speak freely, not promote an argument or protect an ego. I would think somebody with such ancestry would embrace that & not try to twist it to make their argument & pump their ego.

    I should have responded to this the first time you wrote something stupid about me so maybe your second attempt to assail my character wouldnt have happened. Sometimes taking the high road & not responding to peoples ugliness is misinterperated as a weakness, which mistakingly gives permission for all compelled to write what ever they feel like writing about someone else, even if it is personal, insulting, not related to guitars, uncalled for and frankly, none of their damn business.

    Bidlin, you do not have permission to insult me & my character here on this forum. It is inappropriate & uncalled for. Any further attempts to slander my character will be answered, ad neaseum. There is no winning in this. When fighting to protect yourself & your character, winning doesnt matter, only that you fight & stand up for yourself. So keep your ugly to yourself please so I dont have to keep fighting with you. And remember, it was you who insulted me. Please save the 'you insulted me when you brought up American free thinking' line I know is rattling around in your head. Thanks.
     
  16. dbb

    dbb Well-Known Member

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    Man, I never liked Bigsbys nor thought the Stetsbar looked good but everyone is entitled to their own opinions...but hey, gang, I'm no moderator but none of these wiggle sticks is worth getting upset about.

    So back to the issues.

    For me it's simple. The only guitar that I ever really thought was made for a vibrato arm was the Strat and the later super-strat/Floyd rose thing.

    Yes, there are great sounds with Bigsby SG's, Teles, 335's, etc. But my style can get by fine without them, except on a Strat type guitar, where it "belongs"...and even then rarely.

    So since that's *my opinion* I can pontificate without bias. So the rule is "whatever works for you" is right.

    Cheers, mates.
     
  17. Tony M

    Tony M Well-Known Member

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    "This thread needs to be left to die its miserable
    fate and walked away from lesson learned."
    Someone needs to heed their own posts.
    :ohno::hmm::applause::wave::)
     
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  18. Tony M

    Tony M Well-Known Member

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    "Once again, my personal apologies to everyone for personally crossing the line."

    The sincerity of an apology becomes questionable when someone
    continually repeats the behavior that brought about the apology.

    "I hope we all can move forward with a little bit more respect
    for each other & get back to enjoying our forum."

    "Bidlin, you do not have permission to insult me & my character here on this forum.
    It is inappropriate & uncalled for. Any further attempts to slander my character will
    be answered, ad neaseum. There is no winning in this."

    Let me make sure I have this right.
    We can all move foward and get back to enjoying OUR forum but that
    hinges on all of us letting you have the last word in this thread.

    :hmm:

    OK.
    I cannot speak for all my fellow ETSG members but I can probably manage
    to make the tremendous sacrifice of no longer bathing in your nearly
    infinite wisdom and basking in the glory of your magnificent eloquence.

    (You spelled Bidden incorrectly in your latest rant by the way.)

    As far as I am concerned, your most recent rant in this thread does give
    you the last word on this forum because I will no longer read your posts.

    Have a nice life.:wave:
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2012
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  19. dbb

    dbb Well-Known Member

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    Ah, shucks, I thought I had the last word with my humorously inflammatory flippant comments. Oh well......:ohno:
     
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