The new 2017 SG Standard!

Discussion in 'Gibson SG' started by bwotw, Sep 1, 2016.

  1. VincentHiwatt

    VincentHiwatt Member

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    I don't like the new special T with full size humbuckers. I likes the old 2016 model with mini humbuckers and the price was very friendly. I heard only good reviews of it and especially the T version.
    Whey did they remove the selector button plate, how do you call it ? Why did they fell they should change it again ? They remove that plate on all models and I'm not sure it's a good idea. It's a change for a change. I hope it's in the bag as spare part.
    I'm not convinced by this 2017 models. 2016 is said to be a good mill├ęsime.

    And I don't like the new body shape of the Standard either. The neck joint looks thicker. There is a reason I bet but access to 22th will be harder than previous neck joint. The horns are thick like in my SG Townshend Special, the layout of the knobs, lack of selector switch plate. The grovers are heavy for the SG balance and the locking mechanism doesn't work well on my Les Paul. It takes more time to change strings with these locking mechanism than with standard tuners. (I will reverse to Deluxe I think). Anyway, it's not like I wanted to buy an SG in 2017. Maybe reviews will be good. Sound should be good since they have the 57 classic pu and that's what matters.

    They should reintroduce the 61RI. It's the best SG.
     
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  2. Goldmember

    Goldmember Well-Known Member

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    For arguing on ETSG on a Sunday, Goldmember hereby orders that your punishment be severe and swift: All involved parties must sit, watch, and listen to this entire Air Supply clip, including Goldmember, himself:

    Then, you must write a 300 word essay expounding the beauty and originality of the stage set, as well as the sweet and gentle treatment of the melody and lyric.
     
  3. PermissionToLand

    PermissionToLand Well-Known Member

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    My hands are on the small side and I struggle sometimes picking out the high notes on a Les Paul (of course SGs are easier :cool:).

    Which makes me marvel at the fact that Slash can play anything up there with his thick fingers, much less intricate leads...

    [​IMG]
     
  4. bluesfordan

    bluesfordan Member

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    "That is clearly and blatantly in violation of the Geneva Convention and every single moral code known to the civilization of mankind."
     
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  5. Raiyn

    Raiyn Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    Slash apparently is one of those "life's not fair" kind of guys. I watched some biography thing on him and according to a childhood friend he was awesome at everything including random things like BMX. Dude's awesome, can't fault him. I might harbor a tiny tinge of jealously but who honestly wouldn't envy that level of skill as a sub hack player like me?
     
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  6. Col Mustard

    Col Mustard Well-Known Member

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    so all right... there seems like a lot of technical discussion on this thread, so I'm going to ask a civil question
    or three and expect some civil answers: to wit

    Q: What is the advantage of the ABR-1 bridge? There must be one, because it's still being manufactured.
    My knowledge of guitars tells me the ABR-1 was abandoned in the '70s in order to give guitarists more
    travel in the bridge saddles. Norlin came up with the Harmonica bridge to do this, and the Nashville bridge
    was substituted in the post-Norlin era. What to people like about an ABR-1? (I'm actually curious, not owning
    one or ever having played one). It's more narrow than a Nashville, and has less room for adjustment. That's
    the only difference I can see. What am I missing?

    Q: What advantage is there to the various neck joints that are discussed on this thread? I read through this
    thread where these are discussed, and I can see that some players have strong preferences, but why?
    This from someone who regards neck shape as irrelevant as well. I have a number of guitars, and they all
    have different neck shapes and neck joints, and I never think about that. So 'splain me here, what is the advantage
    of the neck joint you prefer? (Once again, I really want to know what various players think. I have no opinion
    myself.)

    No flaming or arguing please... just tell me (and the rest of us) why one of these features might be a deal
    breaker on a shiny new Gibson that they are asking too much money for, but that we drool over anyway.
    I personally don't look down on anyone for what they prefer, and I'm always curious. I only own two Gibsons
    but I love them with a deep loyalty.
    controls@100.jpg
    I never cared for the switch washer and have replaced mine with hand carved wood pointers. I never wanted anyone to tell me which pickup to use for which style. And I like knobs that
    go to 11, purely as a subtle personal statement.


    On this forum, we maintain a pretty good peace. We do that by the common understanding that you don't need to
    prove your point to anyone... just stating it is enough. We will all read what you have to say, and make up our own
    minds anyway. That works pretty well, and the advantage is that we get to share opinions and knowledge (and mistakes
    as well) and we are all richer for it. No one's opinion is the best, or the most valuable... certainly not mine.
    There are a number of very diverse individuals here, from many nations... and I'm always interested in what some
    other player might say or think. I might learn something. *grins
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
  7. Sp8ctre

    Sp8ctre Well-Known Member

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    Col., I think I'm right here with you on this one. I sometimes buy into these things with nothing but hearsay...as with the ABR-1 thing. I do not have enough technical understanding to see why one is so much better than the other. As for neck size and shape all I can say is that if I pick up guitars one after the other with drastically different neck sizes or shapes it just takes me a few minutes to adjust and then I'm fine...

    So I would also like to hear from the crowd here as to what their valued opinions are on this....

    ...and thanks as usual for a thoughtful well written post!
     
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  8. Biddlin

    Biddlin Well-Known Member

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    Gibson changed the design due to a number of concerns that cropped up with the ABR-1. For some they are minor irritations, but why put up with them: rattling saddles ( use a retaining clip on each saddle), loose retaining wire (gone on the Nashville), not enough travel for a full range of intonation adjustment (so the new one is wider), and thin threaded posts that bend so the entire bridge leans (so the new one has larger posts with integral thumbwheels), and the wood top getting stripped out from the metal threads being put directly into it (hence the threaded inserts). Of course no good deed goes unpunished and the "purists" will all have their nits to pick, but I own both, and find the tonal differences inconsequential, other than I never get a "buzz" from my Nashville bridges and adjustment is much easier.
    [​IMG]
    Short tenon on top, long tenon on the bottom. If you are using it as an oar, the long tenon is the ticket. Tone wise, I don't think it matters, but some folks claim to hear the direction of the grain, so.........
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Solid neck vs scarf joined headstock

    The solid neck, a Gibson feature, is thought to transfer sound better than the scarf joint design used by many if not most builders these days. I've repaired breaks on both and from that point of view the solid neck is usually easier to fix, but construction experience tells me that the scarf joint could be much stronger than solid wood. Tone wise, you can't tell the the difference.
     
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  9. Col Mustard

    Col Mustard Well-Known Member

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    excellent explanation... I knew there was more wood contact with the 'long tenon" but never saw a cutaway like that.
    My two SGs seem plenty strong enough to do what I like to do with them. I treat them with respect, and guard their
    vulnerable points.

    If I want a Canoe Paddle, I'll use my Telecaster.

    Oh and I have two Epiphone guitars... I think they both have scarf joints at the headstock. On my ES-339 the neck is varnished
    so you can see the joint clearly. But it's nicely executed and seems like a very practical idea. Oh and I'm getting great tone
    from this Epi, so whatever the designers did to produce this, they're onto something. It's a plywood shell attached to a maple center block, and the neck is glued into that big chunk of wood. The "hollow' body feature is just for looks
    I fear... kinda like a pair of hollow wings attached to a log. Les Paul's old idea...
    still good in two thousand effing sixteen.
    headstock back@100.jpg
    neck back 3@100.jpg
    The mahogany neck glued into the maple (plywood) body looks great to my eye, so of course I like the
    looks of the NEW Gibson with the maple neck sticking out of the mahogany. *grins I'm sure not everybody would,
    so let me say this about that:
    My 2012 SG special '70s tribute has a maple neck in a mahogany body, and I absolutely love this one.
    There was a lot of neigh saying when Gibson introduced this model... mostly involving the baked maple fretboard
    that Gibson was forced to use, and we didn't get to consider as an option. But the maple neck was criticized as
    not "Gibson-like" enough... *shrugs ...oh there was a lot more hooey, but slowly guitarists seemed to accept the idea.
    So Gibson is still using maple necks on SGs. Mine is very stable and rigid, and to me, the instrument stays in tune
    better than my older SG with mahogany neck. So it's a good thing IMHO.

    Anybody who plays a Fender guitar knows this. Ol' Leo figured it out in like 1949, just after I was born.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
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  10. PermissionToLand

    PermissionToLand Well-Known Member

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    He actually was making money and getting attention as an up-and-comer when he discovered guitar and left the bike behind.
     
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  11. SG standard

    SG standard Well-Known Member

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    Funnily enough, I always thought the 'Rhythm/Treble' poker chip was a bit ridiculous - I've been tempted to get a Bass/Lead one - but now they've removed it I sort of miss it. Daft really...

    I can dig the volume controls going to 11, but why not the tone controls too? A bit too bright perhaps? :)
     
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  12. bwotw

    bwotw Well-Known Member

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    Yes, it's mostly tradition and looks. I certainly prefer the looks of it. As far as intonation, the Nashville has the obvious edge. But I have to say, with 10s on E Standard, my ABR1 guitars intonate just fine. When I was using 12s down a full step, I had problems both on Nashvilles and ABRs (usually one or two saddles on the wound strings wouldn't have enough travel by a tiny bit)

    The only functional advantge of the ABR1 over the Nashville I can think of would be that's it's easier for the strings to clear the back of the bridge, sometimes the angle make them touch it a bit. Of course, you can remedy that by putting the tailpiece higher, but that changes the break angle and (arguably) the feel and tone.
     
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  13. Raiyn

    Raiyn Well-Known Member

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    I saw this today. I regained some perspective on this.

     
  14. koaguilds

    koaguilds Well-Known Member

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    For me, and only speaking for myself and my humble opinion, I prefer the long neck joint SG's because in owning both I have experienced neck flex with the short joint SG's due to the way I rest my arm on the guitar and pull back some on the neck. I don't really experience this on the long joint models and I think its due to the deeper sides of the actual tenon allowing a somewhat more stable platform. Les Paul complained of the same thing in a video done shortly before his death so I know I'm not alone on this.

    No offense intended to the 61' RI devotees, if it doesn't flex for you that's great. But for me it does.
     
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  15. Raiyn

    Raiyn Well-Known Member

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    Hey @SG standard I had a chance to look at those knobs by means of my PC.... You're right they SUCK! That said, they probably wouldn't be a deal breaker, but damn they look fugly in a blown up picture. Those'd be in that sealed padded box as soon as it got in the house along withe the TRC. I'd probably swap 'em for another set of those silver MIJ wavey knobs, but that's me.
     
  16. Col Mustard

    Col Mustard Well-Known Member

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    I believe that this flexing action you speak of is one of the reasons that Les Paul disdained the SG... He said,
    "Take my name off the thing, it's not my design." Les Paul liked a rigid neck, set into a big (heavy) chunk of wood.

    I also believe that the long tenon was developed by Gibson in the mid Sixties as a fix for the problem. So you are not mistaken in your
    humble opinion, except that I think the modern "short tenon" guitars have had attention paid to this, and are much
    stronger than the early sixties SGs. Another reason to avoid vintage guitars (for me anyway) besides the prices.

    I've heard other players say they can't stand SGs... and maybe this is what they're talking about. It's a mystery
    to me. Stylistically I never seem to put any pressure on my guitar's neck joint, so I don't even know whether my
    two SGs have the short tenon or the long one. Mine are both SG specials, one's a '07 and one's a 2012. Whatever
    they are, they suit me fine.

    Oh and if you find yourself pining away, wishing for a switch washer on your new SG, just boogie you down to the nearest hardware store and buy a stainless steel washer with a 1/2" hole in it. Cost ya fifty cents. No snotty words written on it. Buy a couple more, and unscrew yer strap screw, fit the washer on, then the strap and screw it back in. World's most secure strap lock. Never come off till the leather breaks. Cheaper than Grolsh beer washer, but you don't get the beer with it.
    Body 4@100.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2016
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  17. Gibsg

    Gibsg Well-Known Member

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  18. Robert Herndon

    Robert Herndon Well-Known Member

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    I'm a huge fan of the big pickguard and fat/wide neck. I'm glad I bought mine before they made any changes...

    IMG_20160929_1176.jpg
     
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  19. Biddlin

    Biddlin Well-Known Member

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    Yup, this one gives me GAS, too.
     
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  20. koaguilds

    koaguilds Well-Known Member

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    I imagine the top is a paper thin veneer of Koa? Still looks mighty fine!
    I'd replace the retaining wire bridge with a Gotoh wireless and sealed Gotoh Grover style tuners w/keystone buttons immediately though.
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2016

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