Does this SG headstock stamp look right?

Discussion in 'Gibson SG' started by Sparky84, Dec 26, 2018.

  1. Sparky84

    Sparky84 New Member

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    Hi folks,

    First-time poster here; getting some Christmas GAS and thinking about adding to my small stable of electrics, including a couple of Strats, a Tele and a Les Paul. At this point I'm leaning toward an SG, even though the long neck always put me off a bit. But I've warmed to them, and the great tone, light weight and reasonable price are all factors in favor of pulling the trigger.

    But I'm torn between picking up a 2017 low-mileage Standard in Pelham Blue, versus a 2018 or 2019 new Standard in Heritage Cherry. The latter looks more traditional Gibson, but the PB color is also very cool (and not offered in 2018-19).

    So I found a few slightly-used PBs on a well-known trading site, and this one below is the most keenly priced, but looks a bit funky to me. First, the color seems a bit darker than most of the PBs I have seen online and in person. Secondly, the imprint on the back of the headstock doesn't look quite right - the serial number looks larger and deeper than usual, and the word "In" in "Made in USA" appears to be off-set or wrong sized letters. Also, there is no "2017 Model" below it as I have seen on other 2017 Standards.

    I've never bought on this site, although from what I've read it is a very legitimate site with reliable sellers. But I live outside the US and only get back a few days a year, so I really don't want the hassle of trying to return a mislabled guitar. The seller gets good reviews, but who knows.

    So does this look odd, maybe indicating some kind of re-spray of a cheaper model or a Chibson fake? Thanks!

    [​IMG][/URL]
     
  2. papagayo

    papagayo Well-Known Member

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    Fake imho
     
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  3. arcticsg

    arcticsg Well-Known Member

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    From just the one pic, it looks real to me. Would need to see more pics to be absolutely sure.

    Lot of the "special models" and "special colors" don't show the "year/model" under the USA stamping.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2018
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  4. PeteR

    PeteR Active Member

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    1a11aaa-fake.jpg
    AFAIK Gibson doesn't stamp the serial after the lacquer, they do it before
     
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  5. papagayo

    papagayo Well-Known Member

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    2017 stamp should say
    MADE IN
    USA
    2017
    MODEL​
     
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  6. Sparky84

    Sparky84 New Member

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    Thanks, guys - a few more pics below. The front of the headstock looks legit to me, but the color seems a bit dark - granted, this can vary a lot with the lighting and camera, I suppose.

    The jury is still out!

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Norton

    Norton Well-Known Member

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    Bridge changed...knobs, selector switch. Pickguard???

    The body, fingerboard and inlay look genuine. The headstock is slightly strange, but that variation has almost become normal.

    I’d ask Gibson. But from what I see it’s either a very good fake or real. But it doesn’t look like Pelham blue from your pics.

    Some other kind of blue.
     
  8. flognoth

    flognoth Active Member

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    This is legitimate.

    Here's the Reverb listing:
    https://reverb.com/item/17804410-awesome-rare-2017-gibson-sg-in-pelham-blue-w-ohsc-0065

    The same seller also is selling:
    https://reverb.com/item/17836648-awesome-rare-2017-gibson-sg-in-pelham-blue-w-ohsc-0080

    Here's are links to other Pelham Blue SG's from different sellers. They have a different serial, but same font and same lack of model year:
    https://reverb.com/au/item/5508620-gibson-sg-standard-2017-pelham-blue-with-gibson-usa-case-mint
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/2017-Gibso...83.l44720.c10&nordt=true&rt=nc&orig_cvip=true
    https://www.zzounds.com/item--GIBSGS17

    The last one is from Zzounds, who is an authorised Gibson dealer in the States.
     
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  9. poppunk

    poppunk Member

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    On the color, it should be noted that even small lighting changes in the photos can make a huge difference in representation. And a camera doesn't show the same color you'll see; whether it's a good approximation or not depends. And even though it's not crazy like my Teale Flip Flop Special, the Pelham Blue SG I have appears to shift color in person based on lighting.
     
  10. Norlin SG

    Norlin SG Well-Known Member

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    Not having any need for more guitars, but if I did, I don't think I would ever buy a newer Gibson because of the quality assurance issues that have been reported and the totally beyond common sense pricing.

    Maybe with King Henry out of the picture, Gibson guitars might return to some sort of common sense as far as quality and pricing. It's really sad that with most of our manufacturing capability moving overseas, that you can buy better quality than Gibson for a lot less money.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2018
  11. papagayo

    papagayo Well-Known Member

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  12. arcticsg

    arcticsg Well-Known Member

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    Like I posted above, not all 2017s (and 2018s) have the year marked on the back of the head stock. The Standards with special order colors, ones that are not usually listed on their website like Arctic White and Pelham Blue, do not come with the date stamped on the back. Also, some special, custom, and signature models do not have the date on back of the headstock either.

    Do a search on 2017 Pelham Blue SGs, ZZSounds, eBay, or wherever, and look at the back of the headstocks ;)
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2018
  13. DaveInSoCal

    DaveInSoCal Active Member

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    If it were me I would pass based on the fact that I'm not 100 % sure of its authenticity. It would always nag at me so I would spend the extra couple hundred bucks to know it's the real deal.

    Not saying it's not legit, I'm just saying I would pass if I had any doubts.

    Also the cracks in the finish on the headstock on a 2017 would be a deal breaker for me, most likely it has been dropped.

    YMMV!
     
  14. arcticsg

    arcticsg Well-Known Member

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    2017 was the year of the finish cracks, LOL

    I have noticed on the non traditional colors that there have been cracking issues. Lots of 2017 Gloss Yellow and Arctic White SGs have cracks around the nut and headstock area. The yellow GC JRs are notorious for this and more have them than don't, brand new from the factory. I was lucky to find one that doesn't.
     
  15. papagayo

    papagayo Well-Known Member

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  16. Sparky84

    Sparky84 New Member

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    OK, thanks everybody, I guess it’s legit. Who knows why they left the “2017 Model” off the blue ones while stamping it on the cherry ones. A quirk of the factory.

    Point taken on all the QC issues in recent years. I suppose it’s too much to ask that 2019 models will have improved, given the turmoil the company went through over the past year or so.

    In any case, the main thing is I need to make up my mind once and for all on the color!

    Great forum, thanks for the advice.
     
  17. jtees4

    jtees4 Well-Known Member

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    Looks real to me, and very pretty too! Hard to tell, but it looks like it has fret nibs, if so I'm almost sure it's real.
     
  18. Col Mustard

    Col Mustard Well-Known Member

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    Welcome to ETSG

    My own attitude on this subject is NOT what you want to hear
    but I'll lay it on you anyway. ETSG wisdom says:

    PLAY IT BEFORE YOU BUY IT

    Buying a guitar unseen and unplayed from a stranger on the internet is
    not too smart IMHO... because the fakes are getting better and better.
    I didn't attempt to say fake or genuine, because I don't see anything that's
    obvious. But the Chinese and Eastern European fake guitar makers do read
    these boards (maybe) and they certainly read MLP... There's more profit
    in fake Les Pauls than anything. They've been reading how we detect fakes
    and taking notes. So don't buy from a stranger, on the basis of reviews written
    by gawd knows who.

    You must go where they sell SGs... and play as many as they'll let you.
    Buy the one that comes alive in your hands. That's the way to find your SG.
    When you bond with an instrument, the color becomes unimportant. The
    year class becomes unimportant. Minor flaws become unimportant.
    This is the truth... Bond with an instrument, and it's all about the music.

    When you play it before you buy it, then you can listen to the tone.
    Don't buy it if you don't like the tone... then you won't need to write posts about
    swapping out the pickups.
    Don't buy it if you don't like the neck. Then you won't need to write posts about
    how the neck isn't like some other guitar you used to love.
    Minor flaws on a great guitar are no big deal, but if you disagree with this wisdom
    then play it before you buy it. Bring your magnifier and examine it carefully before you
    reach for your mastercard. Then you won't have to write posts about finding something
    cosmetically wrong with your new guitar... AND you won't have to buy it if the switch
    crackles or the pots seem unresponsive.
    Don't buy it if it's headstock heavy. (which eliminates SGs with Grover Rotomatic tuners
    on them) Rotomatics are too heavy for an SG, and cause annoying neck dive. The one
    you posted has the offending tuners. The only way for you to know if you can play it like
    that is to play it. I would never buy an SG that had rotomatics. There are much
    better choices. My two SGs balance perfectly.... as they should.

    If you are housebound and absolutely cannot walk into a guitar store, then buy online from
    an established vendor like Sweetwater, where they will set your new guitar up for you before
    shipping. Sweetwater employs guys who actually know how to do this, so it's worth paying
    their prices. IMHO it's better to buy online from a dealer like that, and avoid risky deals
    with unknown persons.
     
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  19. gball

    gball Well-Known Member

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    I think others have covered it but I'll chime in to say it's legit. A 2017 limited-run in Pelham Blue for AMS/Zzounds. The special-run stuff does not get the year stamp, and the reason the cherry ones have it is because they are a stock color. Obviously someone put HP knobs and a chrome poker chip on it.

    Anyway, killer guitars, I have the same model from Zzounds, and so I figure I should mention that these are still available, brand new, from them: https://www.zzounds.com/item--GIBSGS17
     
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  20. Col Mustard

    Col Mustard Well-Known Member

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    there it is... from a member who has one and knows about it,
    and offered stock from a reputable dealer, so you don't have to
    wonder.
     

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