Finally! A Norlin Era I might want..but is the price retarded??

Discussion in 'Gibson SG' started by likea45, Jun 26, 2014.

  1. likea45

    likea45 Well-Known Member

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    As some know I've been hunting for a tobacco sunburst NORLIN era SG in relatively good shape.

    Recently this one popped up on eBay but she looks ridden hard and put away wet, has had major body repair, no case AND a refret.

    I'm not ashamed to pay for something if the value is there but my senses tell me this guy is a little (or a lot) higher than the guitar should be based on the issues shown.

    Thoughts everyone?

    1974 Gibson SG Standard Tobacco Burst Refret in 2011 Original 711106002569 | eBay
     
  2. everdying

    everdying Well-Known Member

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    seller says repairs done to headstock, neck and body.
    ok i see a headstock break, what is possibly a body/neck crack...and a crack where the output jack is.
    guess i wouldnt pay more than $600 for it...that also may be alittle generous as it doesnt even have the OHSC.
     
  3. sgtbeefheart

    sgtbeefheart Well-Known Member

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  4. eS.G.

    eS.G. Well-Known Member

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    To answer the title question
    Looks gorgeous
    Price=Retarded
    Shes damaged goods man. but hot......in a dirty way ........sorta like a washed up stripper,
    but those are cheaper.
     
  5. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Well-Known Member

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    Price is wack..the second one I posted on your profile a couple weeks ago had less repair work and could've been had for $750...
     
  6. likea45

    likea45 Well-Known Member

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    When was that didn't see a post?
     
  7. LeadFinger

    LeadFinger Well-Known Member

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    Similar to the one AngusMadeMe was looking at (which was a '75, but same color). That one was asking $1,600 and looked to be in mint condition. They're out there!
     
  8. Col Mustard

    Col Mustard Well-Known Member

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    if you've got that much to spend, you've got a lot of choices.

    I'd just buy a three or four year old '61RI or one of those classics with
    P-90s from 2008 or so and then own one of the best SGs ever made.

    As a matter of fact, for what the guy wants for this busted up old
    warhorse, you could probably get both. From a practical player's POV
    those would serve you better and maybe sound better too.
    Not trying to piss anybody off, I actually own several vintage instruments.
    But I didn't pay huge prices for them. I'm just old (vintage) too.
    It's a cool old SG, I'll give you that.

    I look at the "vintage' market with a lot of skepticism... the prices asked
    for "vintage' guitars are so high that the ugly head of corruption and fraud
    turns that way. who needs it? there's no tone advantage that a live audience
    might notice or care about. (IMHO of course). Maybe a studio musician could justify owning one of these, because in a studio the tone difference might be important.
    But in these days of so much tonal wonderment in the studio, the sound of
    the old guitar is probably among the excellent models available online. *laughs
     
  9. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Well-Known Member

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    June 3rd..I left two visitor messages on your profile page..click on your screen name, they're still up there..should've showed up in your notifications as "Unread Visitor Messages"..was on eBay and saw those, I knew you were looking for one..
     
  10. likea45

    likea45 Well-Known Member

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    I hear the shouts of practicality loud and clear. However I'm a collector of guitars that I first visually resonate with. A finish or pickup choice or knob color or all of the above smacks me in the face and I can think of nothing else until I either find the exact guitar or refinish one to look like the one I want which you've seen many times. With that said I'm certainly not dropping $1800 on an abused instrument even if it was owned by (insert guitar legend of choice here).

    The hunt continues!
     
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  11. Oldgibsonguy

    Oldgibsonguy Member

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    I can't understand the reason to buy a guitar specifically based on the year manufactured with few exceptions. In particular you're choosing to seek out a Norlin era guitar and actually wondering if a guitar that's been beaten, has a broken headstock and neck joint is a good value. Please consider this. If you're collecting or just need to say you own a guitar from the Norlin era please take your time and buy one worth owning. If you're a player, please consider one of the better guitars Gibson now manufactures, or perhaps even a custom shop SG. You'll be happier in the end. And, yes, I can see you have a large number of SG's, but still wonder why you might want to add one of such questionable value as the one you point out for sale on Ebay. YMMV.
     
  12. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Well-Known Member

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    I own 2 '60's SGs, 2 Norlin era SGs and one from the '90's..each of them exhibit their own pluses and minuses..funny enough, have never had any issue with the Norlin ones..(except replacing the stock 300K/100K volume and tone pots in my '76 SG as I prefer 500K audio taper, and my '72 SG had those stock, as well as steel tailpiece studs, which the current SGs don't even have..), and I will say this..both of the Norlin's kicked a Custom Shop '09 Historic SG ass up and down the street..a very serious (and expensive) disappointment..the '76 was heads and shoulders above the Historic in terms of, fit, finish, playability, sustain, resonance and TONE..in contrast, the Historic had sh*tty mismatched pots, that were way out of spec, a sloppy wiring job, fake "Bumblebee" caps, a boomy neck pickup, regardless of adjustment, a weak, shrill and thin bridge pickup, bent ABR-1 posts, terrible VOS finish, laughable "aging" of hardware and incorrect body contours..also felt stiff and unmusical, felt like I had to fight it to play..all and all, a real let down. The Norlin '76 just melts in my hands and has more snarl, bite and grit, stays in tune, and a neck tone to die for, as the pickup is right up against the fretboard like a Les Paul..and although causes much disdain with many, holds it's own with my "Golden Era" SGs..
    Things got real ugly quick comparing the Historic to my '65..not even CLOSE...:laugh2: Bottom line, Gibson's claim of how accurate of a reissue the Historics are, is false..
    People seek out Norlin era SGs for their own applications..and I believe that they excel in hard rock and heavy metal..period. Those used to the "Golden Era" specs were put off by the construction changes that made the SG not look is sleek as it once did, but many warranty issues forced this, and were done when CMI, the parent company of Gibson, still ran the show..which although Gibson was bought by ECL in Dec. of '69, CMI still had full control of Gibson's operations until 1974, when the Norlin conglomerate was formed..funny how much the "Norlin" name gets kicked around for the funky SGs from '71-'72, yet wasn't even a word or term until 1974.
    Bottom line, there was good and bad in EVERY era, not fair to single one out..good news is there are 100's of 1000's to choose from, and there's the right SG out there for everyone!:thumb:
     
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  13. LeadFinger

    LeadFinger Well-Known Member

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    The build quality on my '72 SB 350 is shockingly good overall. The problems I've had were from previous owner abuse due to the eastern rock maple neck being stubborn.

    Aside from who owned the company when, it was the same workers building Gibsons until they shifted production from Kalamazoo. Mine was part of a cost-cutting Big Idea --and it's made and finished with great care. No drooping neck glued in at 5 degrees! Those guys knew what they were doing, regardless of who their bosses where. I see more sloppy work on the new ones.
     
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  14. Oldgibsonguy

    Oldgibsonguy Member

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    I don't think there's anything funny about the CMI/Norlin era at all. It was a sad time at Gibson all around. I think you may have missed my prior post where I stated that not every Norlin or CMI era guitar was poorly manufactured, and if that had been the case Gibson would be gone.

    What a shame your historic or custom shop guitar was built with such poor quality. I suppose you spoke with Gibson and they attempted to remedy the problems. My experience with Gibson, which extends back to the early 60's, has been that they are always more than helpful concerning the quality of their guitars to the point where even a replacement can be obtained if needed. I, on the other hand, own a large number of custom shop guitars of all types, and any of them will play, sound, and look better than your run of the mill reissue. Now I'm wondering if you might have been sold a knockoff or other type imitation of the real deal.

    Regardless, and as I had already stated, each person sings their own song, and if a Norlin era guitar makes someone happy that's all that really counts. I also suppose in the end there may be more fun in the challenge of finding one that's worth having.
     
  15. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Well-Known Member

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    It was the real deal..lesson learned to "try before you buy"..I wasn't the original owner, so I didn't bother to contact Gibson about it..and I tried every trick I knew to eek the tone I need out of it..I have a test I do to see if the SG will do what I need it to..I turn tone down to 0, grab a big G note, 3rd fret low E, and slide it to B..it has to have that "honk" or "croak"..and it either will, or won't..no in between. My '65 does it..(and HOW, probably the most out of my SGs) the '76 does it, even when it had the 300K/100K pots, the '72 SGI does it very well, though I did swap out the .022 uf cap with a .033 from an EB0, it really honks! All maple body with the minihumbucker can be bright, but the .033 helps to dial a lot of the treble back..but is nice to have the extra treble bite if you are soloing through a torqued up 100 watt JMP SuperLead Marshall!! Cuts like a scalpel. And gets really throaty and croaky with that cap with tone set to 0. And the '94 SG-I, a lower end model, 24 fret, no pickguard, 500T HOT pickup with a coil tap, does it very nicely, even being ultra low end..I think they sold these for $399 new as part of the "All American" line..hell of a SG for the price..it's my "Heavy Metal Junior".:thumb: (My '94 Flying V does it well too!)
    I tried every trick I knew on that Historic..I really wanted to like it..but it was just a turd..
    I did the following in hopes of improvement..
    Buffed off that awful VOS crap..final finish worked looked half assed, not "Vintage Patina"..
    Replaced fake Bumblebees with 60's NOS Sprague Ceramite caps.
    Replaced stock brass studs (for that year, they eventually used steel in later years)
    Replace lightweight tailpiece with heavy Zamak/zinc..the ligtweight doesn't belong on a SG IMO..that works better with Les Pauls..
    Replaced bridge inserts for nylon..
    Replaced tuners for more accurate Kluson Double ring/single line version, in which two of the keystone buttons crumbled in my hands..:mad:,then Grovers with hopes of adding to the tone. (which they really do, more focused and low mid heavier)
    SO by this point, really only the pots could be the next change..not so sure that would've done it either..I just wanted rid of it..and regret trading in my Explorer to fund this..
    I probably got a dud, but it has soured my tastes for anything new..my experiences with Historic Les Pauls was a lot more positive, mainly because I had no vintage examples to compare them to! Here's my SG family then...
    [​IMG]
    And now..
    [​IMG]
     
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  16. Oldgibsonguy

    Oldgibsonguy Member

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    This may seem like a silly question, but do you strictly collect or are you a working musician. And that's a very nice collection.
     
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  17. Kris Ford

    Kris Ford Well-Known Member

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    I'm definitely a working player, I'm in 2 bands currently, a late '70's/early '80's influenced hard rock band (think The Sweet, Motley Crue, Judas Priest, UFO, but all original) and a doom metal band (like Black Sabbath, but lower, slower and heavier) I have a vintage 100 watt Marshall JMP SuperLead and 1982A cab, with it's original G12H30 Celestions..that's been dragged all over Detroit for almost 20 years..
    Music is my life, I sit and noodle for at least an hour or two, more if I got the apartment to myself, got a Marshall Class 5 for bedroom duties but love to rip through the Big Marshall on practice nights, during the week I'm an assembler at riflescope factory..most of my guitar purchases come from trade ins, xmas bonus money/xmas gift money/ B-Day $, or income tax returns..
    Also, thank you for your service in VietNam..vet here as well..USN..2 tours of the Persian Gulf, the first time we were there.
     
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  18. Oldgibsonguy

    Oldgibsonguy Member

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    Thanks for the service Kris. Almost 3 tours in country and 8 years in. Age 62 here and starting to wind down in a hurry. Currently out of work on a disability. I still have a working band but do little touring these days, and most of the gigs come in the form of requests. I don't look for work anymore, don't need to and don't want to. My genre is 60's classic rock, Memphis Blues and soul. Another thing I do is rebuild Fender amps from the 50's through mid 70's and have a steady "A" level following from across the country. The deal is I re-voice these amps one at a time to the customers taste and needs. When I'm done the people I do them for send me what they feel is correct, and I never quote a price for anything other than the parts, which are not marked up. My current stage rigs are a small hoard of classic Fenders including a 65' Deluxe, 72" Deluxe, a pair of 66" Super Reverbs, a Pro Reverb, Super Reverb, and a pair of Twin Reverbs. I also provide pro sound and the current JBL system I own will cover 2000+ people with ease. All SRX cabinets, Soundcraft digital board, etc.. I give it 3 more years and everything but the amps and guitars will go. The guitars and amps are for my daughters some day.
     
  19. likea45

    likea45 Well-Known Member

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    The NORLIN aspect really only comes in to play because the specific git I'm hunting for was made by them in that era of Gibson history. I collect guitars I intend to play and play out touring most of the year in an alt rock band. For me a fellow forum member picked up a 74 standard in tobacco burst and I thought it just looked wicked. When that happens either I think that's cool and good for them or it sticks with me like "I want one of those". This was the case with the 70s tobacco burst standard. I currently own 2 custom shop pieces and both of mine have been above board in terms of quality. I don't mind a "players" guitar. I'm not a collector that harbors case queens although I do take care of my instruments so a used piece that matches what I'm after will do just fine.
     
  20. everdying

    everdying Well-Known Member

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    exactly! :)
     

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