Get a load of this ripoff!

Discussion in 'Gibson SG' started by PermissionToLand, Mar 5, 2021.

  1. PermissionToLand

    PermissionToLand Well-Known Member

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    https://reverb.com/item/38888175-gi...p-les-paul-guitar-61-reissue-920-d-pro-player

    So this shop is taking bog standard USA Standard '61s and screwing on some new plastic parts and borderline lying about it being a Custom Shop model through deceptive wording. He also deceptively implies it had gold hardware originally which it did not. Even makes his own COA because he's genuinely proud of his ability to turn a screwdriver and totally not trying to lend a veneer of legitimacy to his grift...

    Not to mention that little extra top half of a pickguard he screwed on is hideous.

    $1,999 Standard '61 Maestro + $20 in plastic = $3,400.

    This kind of stuff really chaps my ass.

    Edit: I missed that he added a third humbucker. Unspecified as to what it is though. We'll be generous and assume it's a real Gibson '61R and say he put $140 into the guitar before marking it up by $1,400.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
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  2. cerebral gasket

    cerebral gasket Well-Known Member

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    Serial number is not even Custom Shop format.

    The "CUSTOM" on the truss rod cover plate and tenon cover is also ridiculous.
    The neck has trapezoid inlays, not large block inlays.

    Trapezoids = Standard
    Large Blocks = Custom

    And that half-baked excuse of a batwing that doesn't even extend past under the bridge.

    Besides, what's a batwing doing on an SG with the "61" designation?
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2021
  3. PauloQS

    PauloQS Member

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    What an atrocity! Also, how many times did they need to write the word custom? It’s as if they just replaced the overuse of the word “like” for “custom.” “So, custom, I went to this party and, custom, Liz was there and, custom, OMG.”
     
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  4. pancake81

    pancake81 Well-Known Member

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    Pretty ballsy really. On another thread we were just talking about folks that change a TRC on a guitar to fool the uneducated at guitar center and be paid out a higher price.
    This crap is no dofferent
     
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  5. cerebral gasket

    cerebral gasket Well-Known Member

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    Another one I see frequently is SG Specials listed for sale as SG Standards because someone added chrome covers to the Humbuckers.

    Special = Dots
    Standard = Trapezpoids
    1970's = Small Blocks

    I've said it before and will say it again, the neck and headstock markings are what determine the model.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2021
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  6. Norton

    Norton Well-Known Member

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    The only thing about this that bothers me is the price.

    the tenon cover is kinda stupid looking but the rest of the guitar looks cool or at least cool to someone.

    misleading. Not a custom shop guitar.
     
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  7. plankton

    plankton Well-Known Member

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  8. PauloQS

    PauloQS Member

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    I reported this listing. Here’s what I wrote:

    “The seller is adding misleading information. They are implying this guitar is a Gibson Custom guitar by writing custom shop. However, this is clearly a Gibson USA guitar that’s been heavily modded. This is disingenuous and attempting to fool the uneducated buyer.”​

    Reverb is such a good place to sell your gear, it’d be a shame buyers lose confidence on the platform because of bs like this listing.
     
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  9. PermissionToLand

    PermissionToLand Well-Known Member

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    I don't custom this comment.
     
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  10. PermissionToLand

    PermissionToLand Well-Known Member

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    You also have those trapezoid inlay stickers people put on. Luckily, I don't think I've seen one with both chrome covers and stickers trying to pass as a Standard.

    Unfortunately, he seems to have carefully worded his ad to avoid any kind of consequences. He'll argue that "Custom Shop" is referring to his little "customizing" operation and point to the COA he printed as supporting evidence. Everything is worded vaguely enough to mislead while not explicitly claiming it's a Gibson Custom Shop model. Just like the comments about gold hardware imply that he replaced all of the hardware without saying so explicitly because he didn't.
     
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  11. Huntroll

    Huntroll Active Member

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    Besides that, look how the grain changes from the neck to the back of the headstock.
    Its likely had a headstock repair and they covered it up with veneer.
    Not to mention it looks like the E, A, D & G strings are touching the first fret.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  12. Von Trapp

    Von Trapp Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I've seen plenty of listings claiming "Custom" when what they mean is they just modded the guitar. In this case though it says "Custom shop" and I'd say that even though he might argue that he means his own shop where he sells guitars he "customized" it's not a stretch to say it's distinctly deceptive for the reasons you state, ie, there IS a Gibson Custom Shop and when one reads that it is more than fair to assume that that's what's referred to.

    Also did a sh!t job of it, the neck pickup ring is sticking out over the pickguard and so does the bridge one... (lol) (and if you "hand cut" them as he claims, why make two that don't fit instead of one that fits?)

    Trivia: Got a webpage from ca 1992 by the looks of it. http://www.trademarkclassics.com/ (Warning, religious content also) and either refers to himself in 3rd person (!) or his wife does the writing...

    It's clear from the webpage though that he suffers from the delusion that his tinkering with guitars actually enhances their value so I'm starting to think it's not actually meant to be deceptive, he truly believes it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
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  13. Von Trapp

    Von Trapp Well-Known Member

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    One a side note, here's a Custom Shop Gibson Flying V:
    P1020118 copy.jpg

    It's true! I CUSTOM (ized) made it in my (work) SHOP.

    It used to look like this:
    2012-03-20 11.56.27.jpg

    Now guess which one is worth the most money....
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  14. Neezduts89

    Neezduts89 Member

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    So he is basically taking a $2000 guitar, adding a few ugly/cheap parts, printing a certificate, and selling it for what it costs brand new. I’ve never bought a modded guitar and never really looked at one, don’t they lose value that way? I don’t see anything added to this guitar that would justify the price increase. The pick guard looks awful, the center humb doesn’t look to be installed correctly and looks crooked (and this could be a big issue if it decides to not work at all, which could very well happen), and the TRC looks ridiculous. It may look cool to someone and it may be a great guitar for a certain type of person, but the price hike is not justified at all. This doesn’t seem like an honest seller/listing to me and I hope someone doesn’t buy this under the impression that it’s a “Gibson custom shop” because they will be very disappointed
     
  15. Von Trapp

    Von Trapp Well-Known Member

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    I got completely hooked on this and compulsively had to dig deeper. My findings

    - The "we" referred to in the ad is actually just one guy.
    - His wife/daughter, not he, is listed as the owner of this "custom shop"
    - There are no business premises like a store or an office, ie there is no Custom Shop
    - He's studying to be a pastor
    - He's a religious, conspiracy theorist, right wing nut job "We're being overthrown by radical Marxists disguised as Democrats.....Do you understand this yet? Or is your mind still unable to grasp the situation?" - quote from his facebook
    - The facebook likes are from family/church members and friends
    - He claims to have sold a white SG just like this one for 3150$ in November. And by "just like it" I mean complete with the sh!t job defects
    - He's Florida man

    I conclude that he is totally honest in his delusion that what he does enhances the value, most likely factoring in the time he put in and the fact that the item is now "rare" into the price. He honestly believes he has a "custom shop" and that this is how a custom shop works, ie, you mod a guitar then sell it as opposed to someone coming in wanting custom things done to it.

    Absolutely fascinating!
     
  16. PauloQS

    PauloQS Member

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    Great detective work. It’s one of those stories that combines comedy and drama. Makes you want to laugh, feel angry and cringe, while some side of you feels sorry for this delusional individual.
     
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  17. Von Trapp

    Von Trapp Well-Known Member

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    Spot on!
     
  18. PermissionToLand

    PermissionToLand Well-Known Member

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    Geez, I saw the listing was from Florida, but I didn't want to make the low hanging fruit joke. Turns out this guy fits it to a T!

    However, I wouldn't be so quick to assume his delusions of grandeur necessarily mean he doesn't realize he's a ripoff artist. The "studying to be a pastor" part is what got me, because it strikes me that the kind of person who rips people off selling guitars, the kind who is a "prosperity gospel" televangelist (AKA "give me money for jesus") and the kind who, oh I don't know, let's say runs a fake "university" that gets shut down by the Feds, are all one in the same. You can be delusional and a bad person at the same time. In fact, the absurdity acts as a kind of cover because it purchases benefit of the doubt that to be so far off the reservation, you must be genuine. It also rings the bullshit-meter and repels anyone with sense, so you're left with only the easiest targets that won't cause trouble with their incessant critical thinking. There was more, too... I read some article on how absurdity works in favor of grifters, I wish I could remember where it was.

    Then again, maybe we're wrong and he's a groundbreaking entrepreneur and we're just stifling the innovation of the free market! :rofl:
     
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  19. Von Trapp

    Von Trapp Well-Known Member

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    I'd hesitate to second that last part but judging from his facebook, trust me, he is no great thinker himself. And looking at his other projects I get the feeling he thinks he enhances the products. He also does cars and toys (!). Let's hope he's better at those.
     
  20. Ted Parshall

    Ted Parshall New Member

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    Well, it mentions in the ad it’s “from our custom shop” and “from the Trademark Classics Custom Shop” ...so they do make minimal effort to mention that it’s their own mod job. You just really have to read between the lines to catch it.

    Not making excuses for them though. Incredibly tacky and overpriced. The COA takes the cake. So laughable.

    Just find an authentic used CS for that price.
     

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