How did Gibson cut the bevels on an SG?

Discussion in 'Luthier's Corner' started by Silvertone, Nov 24, 2020.

  1. Silvertone

    Silvertone Well-Known Member

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    Still looks cool to me. I don't really care one way or the other. I had just never seen the Les Paul tenon cover before. As I said, I am not much of an aficianado regarding all the different models that Gibson has come out with over the last almost 60 odd years or so. TBH the designs I really like, I just build myself.

    I am not really even sure why you are posting these pictures in this thread? As I said, it's a cool guitar and all but I was hoping to get information / confirmation on how Gibson carved the bevels on the early to mid 60's SGs.

    Regards Peter.
     
  2. chilipeppermaniac

    chilipeppermaniac Well-Known Member

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    Ok Peter, here is a good one. I was doing a bit of homework mental gymnastics on how to find someone or find someone who knows someone, who knows someone ... if you know what I mean.

    2 immediate thoughts. I was hunting for a few fellas I know who know all manner of Gibson details. Some SG some LP etc. One source was Les Paul forums where someone suggested there is an old timer named Jim Hutchins. If you can find him, he may know things. Also, Try Heritage guitars as some of their staff was former Gib employees if I remember right.

    One more idea is to maybe contact Dan and or Mark Erlewine. They are luthiers and guitar builders. I am sure they may have seen how it was done, know folks who worked there or can point you where u might find answers.

    https://www.erlewineguitars.com/pgs/custom.htm
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2020
  3. chilipeppermaniac

    chilipeppermaniac Well-Known Member

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    Pretty sure he is posting because his guitar has one variant of the bevels and may either be close or way off base from what you are after with whatever details you may uncover and as to if the Method yields the type bevel you are interested in, Papa's style, any of my 3-4 styles etc from the 70's 80's 2000's etc.

    I don't think he is jerking you around, hijacking the thread, just posting for attention or any other reason someone not appreciate.
     
  4. Silvertone

    Silvertone Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the tips. Yeah - I do not think he is jerking me around. I was just wondering why he posted a pic of that guitar. It is a cool guitar and I had said I had never seen that tenon cover but remember that Mary Ford's white SG custom had one similar.
    Capture.JPG

    Not sure whether this one is a replica but I love this guitar. Not so much the 3 pups but really like the over sized bound head stock with the split diamond. This one has a blank truss rod cover but an engraved tenon cover. Also the white covers are pretty cool.

    Cheers Peter.
     
  5. chilipeppermaniac

    chilipeppermaniac Well-Known Member

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    Peter, you never saw a tenon cover?

    BTW my first SG was one of those unusual ones, BUT for all the fellas I know who own one, they are diamonds in the rough., My barely Beveled 87 SG 3 knob.
    These guitars feel and play so nicely. I often wondered HOW the guy who sold it to me ever parted with it?

    Almost forgot, The other thing about my 3 knobber is it has the pup right up to the neck, and there is no pick guard.
     
  6. chilipeppermaniac

    chilipeppermaniac Well-Known Member

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  7. Silvertone

    Silvertone Well-Known Member

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    LOL - yeah I have seen a tenon cover. If you read the thread or the other one, I say "THAT" cover meaning the engraved Les Paul one.

    Yeah the bevels have definitely changed over the years. Even the original ones have slight variations. They were all hand sanded back in the day and to various levels of changes to the body shape. That is one of the questions or theories. That a machine was used to carve the bevels at the same angle, probably a shaper / pin router with the guitar on a template. Kinda like my CAD drawing above. The vintage guitars I have measured and scanned have had consistent angles on the body outline but then deeper / more angled on the inner cut away. This is also where those early guitars seem to vary most. So probably all the edges were done with a shaper then the inner horns where sanded deeper. Possibly with a hand held spindle sander. They may have been done completely with a splindle sander as you can see by my drawing a large diameter shaper bit, which would be need for the deep bevels on the sides would not fit in the tight radius of the cutaways. These last 3 or 4 sentences are the essence of this thread but only based on those early SGs.

    More modern guitars are all over the place. Frankly, I think it came down to $$$ and how they could reduce number of hours on the guitar. Smaller bevels is quicker to CNC, easier to finish and polish. Cheaper to make and hence more profit. I might be a little cynical about that but that guitar has lost all of the artistic intent of the original design. IMO, in those days, and earlier, the artrist / designer was a lot closer to the creation of the object.

    I am a CAD designer by trade and prior to Computer Aided Design the draftsman was more of an artist. I believe it was similar back in the 50's - 60's. The Gibson guitars of that era were elegant and designed as pieces of art. This trickled down into the factory and in some cases there were certain individuals that manufactured these objects that interjected their own artistic flair into them. This was possible because a lot of the processes were done by hand. Now everything is computer driven, shipped offshore, designed to fail after a certain amount of time, so you have to buy another to keep the $$$ rolling in. See I told you I was cynical. ;-)

    Cheers Peter.
     
  8. chilipeppermaniac

    chilipeppermaniac Well-Known Member

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    LOL @ me, Peter.
    It must have been super late in the night when my tired eyes were reading through here before I went to bed. I missed where you said "Les Paul" cover.

    My Bad.
     
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  9. chilipeppermaniac

    chilipeppermaniac Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    Funny story, Peter.

    Had I read properly I would not have asked, had you not seen a tenon cover. Which of course is a reasonable question in light of some folks having huge degree of differences in what all we know about all the instruments ever made. Heck, before I bought an SG, I only knew OF some of the players and not much about the history or specs or variations of them over the years ( this was before like 2012)

    Much like if I had only bought the Black SG above and played it as is, and never took interest in how it compared to others etc, I would have never known of tenon covers, long or short tenon eras, Norlin, Pre CBS etc. Heck, I may have never known that an SG with only 3 knobs and the 4 knob ones like Les Pauls were the normal config and I got an oddball without realizing it.

    HAHA when I unboxed it, I thought how cool and yet WOW, did I really not notice it only had the 3 knobs and no guard at all etc? Turned out to be an awesome guitar.
     
  10. chilipeppermaniac

    chilipeppermaniac Well-Known Member

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  11. Blueline

    Blueline New Member

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    They may not be Les Pauls in your book but they sure were in the Gibson Books. The ledger codes the 61 Les Paul as "LP new" for the early ones and then simple "LP" right up to 1963. The price list, hang tags, flyers and catalogues all call these sculptured standards.... Les Pauls . The sculptured Les Paul production began in 1960 with some having a silkscreened Les Paul Model on the headstock. So in my book I'll go with the Gibson naming as it is accurate.
     
  12. Silvertone

    Silvertone Well-Known Member

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    Not really sure what you are talking about here? Are you just talking about the name of the thread? Most people would know these guitars by the SG name and I do not mention that it was the first few years in the thread name?? It's common knowledge that they were called Les Pauls up until mid / late 1962. I think the early "Les Paul" Juniors were the ones with the Les Paul silkscreen because the Standards had the crown inlay in the middle.

    Regards Peter.
     
  13. donepearce

    donepearce Well-Known Member

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    For simplification, and to avoid needless confusion and explanation, stick to the convention that Les Paul refers to the heavy single cut, and SG is the lightweight devil horn double cut with a heavy headstock. I know that technically, the early SGs were called Les Paul, but FFS, if you have to explain what you are talking about every time just ditch that.
     
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