Ltd Ed Tony Iommi Signature SG Custom Production Run Questions

Discussion in 'Epiphone SG' started by WytchCrypt, Mar 24, 2020.

  1. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    I think for me the sad thing is Tony still writes great riffs and always has, yet now if he writes another album, which for all intents and purposes would be the same thing as many/most black sabbath albums, he couldn’t call the band black sabbath. All through the 80s and 90s this is exactly what happened with a revolving door of session players and collaborators like Dio and Geezer who came and went over the years. They were all sabbath albums, and maybe they weren’t the best there was some damn good shizzle on there (I witness, can’t get close enough, when death calls, born to lose, the whole of Dehumanizer, etc.)
    If he does the same thing now and calls it black sabbath he gets sued.
    And Bill Ward didn’t retire due to ill health, he was in good health leading up to 13, it was going to happen with bill, but they wouldn’t offer him a fair contract, which I assume would be 25% of the band share, they wanted to pay him more or less a tour drummer’s fee. Maybe they upped it a bit but not anywhere near what he felt was fair so he couldn’t in good conscience do the reunion album or tour. The management pushed the story of him being ill to the press and the band supported it. There are videos of bill saying this stuff and of Tony at the time claiming bill was too ill to tour. I think you can see in his face he doesn’t like saying it. Bill is cool about it in the interview, he even says those things in front of Tony and geezer if I remember correctly.
    Sadly this is what happens when money and ego and fame come into play, gets in the way of music. Ho I’d have loved for an album with the whole original line up...
     
  2. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    Basically if Tony, Geezer and Bill were all up for it with say Tony Martin or Phil Anselmo or Corey Taylor or even some unknown person and write new music and play classic sabbath, they still wouldn’t be able to call it sabbath.
     
  3. ChubbyFingers

    ChubbyFingers Active Member

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    I stand corrected. Maybe it was ill WEALTH instead then ;-)
     
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  4. WytchCrypt

    WytchCrypt Active Member

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    If there really was doubt that Bill was physically up for touring 13 for the full schedule and they still wanted to be fair with a 4 way split, they could have structured a touring contract that he shared 25% of the revenue from each show he was able to play (or whatever 1/4 of what each of them received). They could have brought any number of drummers along on tour as a backup - would hardly be the first time they had someone waiting in the wings in case Bill couldn't go. To give Bill anything less than 1/4 on the final Sabbath tour or 13 was an insult. That said, do we even know for sure that the contract was equally split between Tony, Geezer & Ozzy/Sharon? I'm afraid whenever you have someone named Arden around a Black Sabbath contract that everyone else is going to get screwed :rolleyes:
     
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  5. purple dragon

    purple dragon Member

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    I think a lot off people forget that this is not personal its just buissness and black sabbath have become a big name that still earn a lot off money and with how capatlism is the mainstream now and everybody wants a piece off the cake.
    Now its easy fore us to just blame Sharon etc but its a lot we dont know that happend that we dont know about.
    You also have to consider that on the last renunion bill did have serveral heartattack and did almost die severale times and they did have to travel with a extra drummer to step In if bill was ill.i guess this is somethink that was a consern and a problem and i have heard rumors that bill did not want to have a extra drummer with them and if true that woued make taking bill on the road hard and troueblesome.

    Second whene ozzy did sue Tony fore the black sabbath name and mercendice sale.ozzy did Ask geezer and bill to joint so the name and all the money woued be split on 4.but both bill and geezer did pass and now Tony and ozzy share 50/50.now the problem here is that whene ozzy did win bill did regret he did pass and now wanted a share and it was to late because the deal was made.my point here is that bill got a chance to Get a 1/3 share but passes and then complaining afther that he did not Get a fair deal.now geezer never did that.he passes his chance and swollowd it and took it like a man and was fine with just be a hired GUN and did Get his pay check from Tony and ozzy.
    Now you got to rember the deal was made and the band was to make the album and go on the road AS fast AS posseble to make money and nobody wanted to wait a year or two to make a new deal and posseble both the album and touer woued be canselled.

    Now whene its all said and done did i wish they coued make a deal with bill so the orginale line up coued play again.hell Yes but it did not happen and all we can wish fore now is that they can make a new deal and make one last show AS has been talking about latly.
     
  6. ChubbyFingers

    ChubbyFingers Active Member

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    They (OIzzy, Tony and Geezer anyway) already did one "farewell" tour that ended in the National Exhibition Centre (NEC) in Birmingham, England, their home town.

    The band finances are there own business but remember Butler wrote most of the classic songs so he gets songwriter royalties anyway.
     
  7. fredlw

    fredlw New Member

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    maybe they used something like this automatic signer? http://realsig.com/atlanticII.htm
     
  8. skelt101

    skelt101 Active Member

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    Not so sure about this statement. I’d say, for the most part: Tony wrote the riffs, Geezer wrote the lyrics, Ozzy came up with the vocal melody, and Bill would orchestrate it all on the drums.
     
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  9. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    You’re correct Skelt, all the first 8 albums were credited Iommi/Osbourne/Butler/Ward, they all shared publishing on those songs!
     
  10. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    Yep, I was at the first of the 2 ‘Final’ gigs they did at the NEC in 1998.
     
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  11. tony1852

    tony1852 New Member

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    for those that have or played both the mk1 and mk2 version of Epi Iommi, thoughts to which one is better? the newer mk2 are harder to get than the mk1. big difference?
     
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  12. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    0A933ED7-6AFB-4EAD-909E-6D77315AE22A.jpeg
    The differences between the two are really only cosmetic, the pickups are the same Gibson USA Iommi signatures in both guitars.
    The Mk2 has the following differences:
    White binding on the neck
    Full size cross inlays all the way down the neck (the Mk1 only has 5 small cross inlays on frets 3, 5, 7, 9 & 12)
    The fingerboard is ebony (Mk1 has rosewood)
    The hardware is nickel plated (Mk1 has black hardware)
    The pickguard is multi ply black and white (Mk1 is is one thick piece of piece of black plastic)
    The jack input is on the side of the guitar (Mk1 is on the front like other SGs)
    Things that are the same:
    The pickups (but different colour covers)
    The body and neck wood (mahogany), although weirdly
    I’ve seen a member on here who stripped their Mk1 and found a maple neck!!!??? I’ve stripped my Mk1 and it is all mahogany, it seems like some particularly nice mahogany.
    I think that’s it.
    As far as sounds go, they sound basically the same, as you’d expect.
    Playability wise there isn’t much difference, I guess I could say my Mk2 feels more luxurious, but would I be able feel the difference in a blindfold test? I doubt it. Both are excellent guitars!
    Here’s my Mk1 at the moment:
     
  13. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    Here’s me with the band playing Into The Void on my Mk1:

    And Children of the Grave with a separate singer this time:
     
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  14. tony1852

    tony1852 New Member

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    your mk1 sounds thunderous!!! is there any difference in feel of the boards? are they pretty much the same profile (shape, width, thickness)? the mk1 is made in Korea, while the mk2 in China. I have lots of good Korean guitars and only 1 good Chinese guitar. You seem to indicate they are both equal, which is great!
     
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  15. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    Ah cheers man! I don’t feel any noticeable difference in the shape of the neck, but I’m a bit rubbish with that sort of thing, I’ve also been playing bass for nearly 20 years so I find it pretty easy to adjust between necks etc, it’s not something I really pay attention to.
    The fretboard feels great on both guitars, I do love the feel of ebony (and maple), but the grain on the rosewood Mk1 fretboard is really nice, tight grain, not open feeling or dry like some of the cheaper ones.
    So the differences in feel between them are very subtle and not something that I could see making one play better than the other, that would purely be down to the ability of the guitar player and your appreciation of the cosmetic elements.
    Or you could do what I did and get both! They might be hard to find, but always harder for me cos I’m left handed! I bought both of them online ‘blind’ like I usually have to!
    Good luck!! I don’t think you’d regret either one, although those Mk1s are going real cheap these days. Pickups alone are worth £200!
     
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  16. Von Trapp

    Von Trapp Well-Known Member

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    Oh, no! Those gigs would have been so much better if only you had a Gibson! (sarcasm)
     
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  17. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    Haha, love it! Funnily enough I’ve had the choice between a couple of Gibson’s and Epiphones for gigs, and the Epis see as much use as the Gibsons...
     
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  18. tony1852

    tony1852 New Member

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    i can't find the mk1's stateside for less than $500-$600+. The mk2's are sold out/back order and very hard to find used. and the pickups probably make the guitar, and as you said those are very pricey too!
     
  19. Grizzlyman

    Grizzlyman Active Member

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    Yeah that sounds about right actually, I paid £475 for my Mk1 but got a decent hard case in the deal. The Mk2 cost me £699 with no case at all!
    They’re the most expensive epiphones that they make, but they are a level above the regular G400 IMO, maybe not the classics cos those are lovely, but certainly they are very nice guitars. I have a G310, a G400 plus the 2 Iommis, a vintage vs6, Gibson Special faded and Gibson SG Junior 60s. I’d rank the Iommi Epis up with the Gibsons. But all of them play great, the differences between them, even the Gibsons are very subtle. Don’t let anyone tell you they are worlds away from a Gibson, they aren’t. Such people probably can’t even make a Gibson sound good!
     
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  20. WytchCrypt

    WytchCrypt Active Member

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    Fantastic job Grizz! Your Epi sounds absolutely crushing and you did a great job of handling both Tony & Ozzy on Into the Void (when I first downtuned my Epi I must have spent hours playing that intro over and over...likely drove my wife crazy). Also you have one of the secrets of putting out a great Sabbath vibe...a drummer who absolutely beats the *&^% out of his drum kit!
    Well done my friend :dude:
     
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