SGs from the 1970s Norlin Era. Pros and Cons.

Discussion in 'Gibson SG' started by SG Champagne, Jan 8, 2010.

  1. sgtbeefheart

    sgtbeefheart Well-Known Member

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    Allan's first guitar was a Hofner President.

    Allan owned a Fender Stratocaster in the early years, one he got from a friend. He used it for about 6 months.

    Later in his career he experimented with Strats again (with Humbucker pickups).


    Then he started playing on a Gibson SG. He owned 3 of them and used them for about a decade. He played on an SG in Tony Williams's Lifetime band.

    In 1972 Allan Holdsworth recorded with a Gibson ES-335.

    He played Charvel guitars for a while.
    Allan experimented with a Chapman Stick (one without bass strings).
     
  2. Angry Tele

    Angry Tele Member

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    i dont think it was him. steve morse maybe? someone like that.
     
  3. BrotherPete

    BrotherPete New Member

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    These mysteriuos pickups

    He Yo,

    I´ve been searching the net for three days until I found this thread...
    Because, I bought a Telecaster guitar equipped with these Plastic-cover minis from a 70´s SG--(By the way-fantastic sounding!)-And I was wondering just as You did...
    Now I don´t have a photo at this point, but there is a little less epoxy filled into the back of the bridge PUP, so, I can say there are in fact two coils in it that seem to be turned on their sides!!! Ok, the magnet in the middle, two blades that go parallel to the strings with coils around them.
    First idea I had was to check out with some pickup parts if this CAN work...Maybe someone of you guys will do that?
    However, I´m happy to share the interest in this Gibson-Mystery...
    And I´m happy with these pickups!
    Best Regards from Germany!
     
  4. BrotherPete

    BrotherPete New Member

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    Anybody interested? I made some fotos now...
    You should see the coils (on their sides) , you can even see the top of the blade coming out from the coil...
    I added a picture of the Tele, I´m just refinishing it.
    I am mainly a Tele Player, but I built some guitars, too, my avatar shows the junior that I made. You could easily find out that it is selfmade - the neck angle is just a bit too wide, so I had to raise the pickup very high.
    I used Honduras-Mahogany and I put a P-94 in it to make things more complete - (Heresy. I know). Sounds and plays good!
     

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  5. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    Pete, I really don't think these are on their sides & parallel to the strings but until we get a pic of one opened up we cant prove anything can we.?. I offered a guy on ebay $45 for a broken one so I could cut it apart & take pics but the greedy bastard countered & wanted $55. Everybody thinks their crap is golden man. So for a greedy extra 10 bucks this guy is sitting on a broken pickup no one will ever buy. He's asking $75 with a good one going for $85. The plastic ear is broken off so who is gonna buy that to mess with a plastic ear that will never stay together CAUSE ITS BROKEN!

    Its the same greedy behavior I see on that American show Auction Hunters where these 2 greedy tards strong arm all their potential buyers into giving up every last penny they have to give with never a deal going to the buyers favor regardless of how many repeat sales they have made with a person. I would love to be that one potential buyer that calls them out for being the greedy bastards they are and tell them to sell your crap somewhere else. I just hate the greed man so screw him & his broken frikin pickup.

    Well get to the bottom of this....some year. Even though I see what you are thinking, I'm almost 100% positive that this is 2 standard steel bladed bobbins laid in traditional direction and not a completely new design. But, being we have no pictures......yet.

    Below is a non epoxied, non pole piece mini.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    I really think the epoxied mini are this style pup covered with epoxy & just can not see Gibson doing a pup redesign instead of filling in an existing pickup the same way they did for the full size humbucker. IMHO.:dude:
     
  6. BrotherPete

    BrotherPete New Member

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    Hey Barry,

    if you could see the pictures in 3D, you could see the round end of the coils in the direction as I described it. But I´m sure some day you´ll find one to cut it up, seems like people don´t estimate these pickups high enough..thinking they were single-coils. Funny! I got this Tele-Beauty with the pickups and a Fender-Neck for 200,00 Euros! LOVL!
     
  7. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    Maybe I'm missing what you're saying. Do you mean the Bobbins on their sides or a completely redesigned bobbin configuration that only covers 3 strings each? If you do mean the later, I need you to think about that for a minute. That is a radical Gibson pickup design that has never been mentioned, talked about or discovered until now with you seeing that outline through that solid black epoxy.:hmm: Just saying, you are asking a lot of a fella.
     
  8. BrotherPete

    BrotherPete New Member

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    Hi Barry,
    the construction is not a big thing, the regular coils (standard 6-string-bobbins) are turned 90° so the blades touch the magnet on it´s sides (shape of magnet is different, not a plate, but square or rectangular).
    The interesting thing is, that the magnetic field (with blades parallel to the strings) obviously is still strong enough to take up string-vibration. I think it is easy to test this, take a Strat-pickup or any other single-coil and hold it close to the strings, but with the magnets (polepieces) parallel, not directed towards the strings. If you get a tone out of the pickup then, that´s it! (In its single-coil version - maybe this works better with the type that has iron polepieces and an extra magnet outside the bobbins?)
    I know you won´t believe it until you´ve seen it!:):)
    Me too, I couldn´t believe it first...

    Meanwhile I have tried with a G&L S500-Pickup, it works! Sure, the signal is a bit weaker.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2013
  9. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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    WHY WHY WHY?!?!? Why design a new pup that fits in the same strange & exact size mini hum pickup covers but now the bobbins are half their length & 2 times their width to fit on the same size case cover? You are talking big money retool. That just isnt feasable, especially when there was no reason to do it. No reason! Just cover the existing pups with epoxy and we are done. Bam! Done. WHY WHY WHY Pete! WHY?? Plus, it would be known about and talked about. No doubt you think you see what you see but like you said, I aint believing anything until I see it.

    Do I actually need to drop $55 on a busted mini hum to settle this or is it just too much fun not knowing?? Hmm. Maybe if I didnt just buy a mid 70's Marshall 2104 I'd think about. As if the initial expense isnt enough to stress the budget, the seller brought it to UPS & being its so damned big & heavy, the seller says he needs another additional 100 to ship. So for now the debate will have to continue but someday, someday, somebody is going to be vindicated. Sideways, huh!
     
  10. Tony M

    Tony M Well-Known Member

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    All this guesswork about the pickups.
    Nobody has a friend with access to an MRI machine?
    Or will that demagnetize the pickup magnets?
    Maybe a CAT scan machine?


    I took my dog to the vet for a check up.
    He took a cat out of a cage, passed it over the dog twice,
    put it back in the cage, told me the dog was OK,





    and charged me $200.00 for the cat scan......
     
  11. JohnP

    JohnP Member

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    He, he....These epoxy potted pickups are meant to be a mystery!
     
  12. Relic61

    Relic61 Well-Known Member

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  13. BrotherPete

    BrotherPete New Member

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    He Yo,
    seems like the x-ray thing must be done by someone...

    I must admit that I still can´t be sure...As I said, there are metal blades looking out of the bobbins (on the sides, yes!) and these blades should theoretically have some magnetic pull...I touched them with a small screwdriver, well, they seem not to have a lot of magnetic pull, it´s all in the middle where the magnet sits...
    The one thing I do not have any doubt about is the position of the bobbins and coils as I described it.

    Anyhow, concerning these big WHY´s, somewhere in Gibson´s history, they say there was a time when they had their pickups made by others, EMG was mentioned if my memory is correct, don´t ask where I read that.
    And: Mr. Lawrence, who was the "Epoxy-Man" at Gibson then, is known for his strong desire to make things "better" everywhere....
    Hey, couldn´t someone ask him? As far as I know, he´s still busy selling pickups....
     
  14. 79StandardMM

    79StandardMM New Member

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    I have a 79 Standard that is an excellent guitar. The grover tuners are the best, smoothest of any of many guitars. I happen to love the neck profile. Thiner at teh nut and fuller in the hand--not as flat--as modern standards. The look is subjective of course. I think they are different and bad ass. Im a punk and noise rock guy so it suits me.
    Cant comment on the original pickups. I have Bareknuckles in mine which sound, of course, great.
     
  15. Crazy_8

    Crazy_8 Well-Known Member

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    Bill Lawrence passed a while back, his wife Becky is still making the pickups and selling them. So I guess he won't be able to shed any light on the Gibson pickup question.
     

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