Template/dimensions for locating tailpiece holes

[skydog6653]

I’m considering a vibrola SG but would want to convert it to a tailpiece bridge. Has anyone here done that before? Good idea or bad?!

 

[purple dragon]

Bad really bad idea.if you want a sg with stoptail then just buy one with stoptail.you can Get most if not all models with stoptail.even a 61 that never came with a stoptail you can Get with a stoptail on the reissue.if it was the other way around i woued understand you because the options of sg with vibrolas is mutch more rare exept fore the last two years whene they did relase a sideway and a masero vibrola models.

 

[skydog6653]

Bad really bad idea.if you want a sg with stoptail then just buy one with stoptail.you can Get most if not all models with stoptail.even a 61 that never came with a stoptail you can Get with a stoptail on the reissue.if it was the other way around i woued understand you because the options of sg with vibrolas is mutch more rare exept fore the last two years whene they did relase a sideway and a masero vibrola models.

What you can’t get on all models (in fact, on very few models), is a decent size neck.

 

[cerebral gasket]

I was in the local big box store and they had a 61/59 Fat Neck SG. Nice and chunky, like 0.900" at 1st fret and 1.000" at 12th fret. But $4500 asking price is ridiculous. There's no reason why they can't build a regular production SG with thick neck for $1500. They all start off as a block of wood. They need to quit sawing so much wood off of the necks and ease up on the belt sander.

 

[Von Trapp]

What on earth would be the point of that?!

 

[Silvertone]

I was in the local big box store and they had a 61/59 Fat Neck SG. Nice and chunky, like 0.900" at 1st fret and 1.000" at 12th fret. But $4500 asking price is ridiculous. There's no reason why they can't build a regular production SG with thick neck for $1500. They all start off as a block of wood. They need to quit sawing so much wood off of the necks and ease up on the belt sander.

They do not use a belt sander to take off the material for the neck. It's all CNC'd and multiples at a time. Volume, volume, volume. In order to make a $1500 guitar with a neck that thick they'd have to sell way more than what they do. They'd rather make tons of the same thing and make much more profit. I have made custom guitars, kits really, with no finish, no parts, for about $1200 with necks that size and larger. It's just the way it is.

Cheers Peter.

 

[cerebral gasket]

They do not use a belt sander to take off the material for the neck. It's all CNC'd and multiples at a time. Volume, volume, volume. In order to make a $1500 guitar with a neck that thick they'd have to sell way more than what they do. They'd rather make tons of the same thing and make much more profit. I have made custom guitars, kits really, with no finish, no parts, for about $1200 with necks that size and larger. It's just the way it is.

Cheers Peter.

 

[Silvertone]

Is this the custom shop? Probably for "true vintage" series guitars. I bet those are not $1500 guitars. Check out at 9:10 mins in this Premier Guitar tour video.



snipit from video - mass neck rough shaping on CNC.


Cheers Peter

 

[smitty_p]

Is this the custom shop? Probably for "true vintage" series guitars. I bet those are not $1500 guitars. Check out at 9:10 mins in this Premier Guitar tour video.



snipit from video - mass neck rough shaping on CNC.
View attachment 48142

Cheers Peter

In a way, you're both right.

The necks are made, initially, by CNC. Final smoothing is done by belt sander.

In the the Premier Guitar video, the comment is made at around 9:01 that the necks are rough cut, but that they still need to be finished off by hand.

In the Gibson video that @cerebral gasket posted, from 1:20 - 2:06, it clearly shows this process. The neck shape is roughed in by CNC according to the program for a particular neck profile, but finished off at the belt sander.

No suggestion is made that this process is only used for one series of guitars vs. another.

It is not "either...or." It is "both...and."

 

[Norton]

easy to mount a tailpiece. there should be tons of videos showing this process.

find the centerline on your neck... your bridge and your lyre tailpiece. establish that line... it's key.

then position your tailpiece at the distance you want it from your bridge.... establish a 90 deg line to your centerline. put your tailpiece on that line. now for the holes....

the trick there is to select a drill bit that snugly fits into the tailpiece "collar" use that to make shallow marks to install the tailpiece stud bushings.

Just be careful of your drilling depth. A drill press makes this easier, but you can do it with a nice bit and a hand drill.

 

[Juan Tumani]

I’m considering a vibrola SG but would want to convert it to a tailpiece bridge. Has anyone here done that before? Good idea or bad?!

It's probably an easier mod than some. Much easier than reversing it.

If you don't get a good fit on the stoptail bushings you'll always have problems. As far as alignment goes it's fairly forgiving as the bridge saddles will keep the strings spaced properly.

You just don't want to go too close to the bridge or the strings will hit the edge of the bridge instead of just the saddles.

Also the finish will crack when you push in the bushings unless you sand away just a little extra at the top of the hole. Not too much but enough that the bushing doesn't put a significant amount of pressure on the finish while passing through.

No chance you want to just not use the Vibrola and leave it in place?

 

[Silvertone]

In a way, you're both right.

The necks are made, initially, by CNC. Final smoothing is done by belt sander.

In the the Premier Guitar video, the comment is made at around 9:01 that the necks are rough cut, but that they still need to be finished off by hand.

In the Gibson video that @cerebral gasket posted, from 1:20 - 2:06, it clearly shows this process. The neck shape is roughed in by CNC according to the program for a particular neck profile, but finished off at the belt sander.

No suggestion is made that this process is only used for one series of guitars vs. another.

It is not "either...or." It is "both...and."

Yeah - I didn't have time to watch that video the other day. Just got to it now. That is marketing BS. He says CNC can't finish shape a neck. LOL Of course it can and I bet it does on most of Gibson guitars. Those are probably custom shop or made to order guitars that get sanded on the deadhead sander for a slightly different profile. If they sold enough of them you can bet they would program the CNC to get every different shape. Notice they said they rough CNC shape, then finish CNC shape, then it goes to deadhead sander? This may let the neck settle in between rough CNC and finish CNC incase the wood moves then they can scrap the neck. He mentioned scanning after the head stock veneer is put on. I wonder if there is an RFID sticker under the headstock veneer. Smart idea so they can track it through construction to make sure the right neck gets on the right guitar. Again probably on the custom shop or made to order guitars that are in the $5 - $10K range. Interesting stuff.

Cheers Peter.

 

[donepearce]

I found that video interesting. The guy was saying that they have really crap CNC machines. Any CNC that is not at least two orders of magnitude more accurate than someone pressing wood against a sanding belt belongs in a dumpster. This all fits with what we know about things like neck angles, which are frankly a lottery. So Gibson, if you really want to be a relevant twenty first century guitar company, go to Korea and see how this should be done. You have been left far behind.

 

[cerebral gasket]

I’ve had both regular production and CS guitars and no two necks feel identical to me.

Thinking it has something to do with the belt sanding process to remove tooling marks from the CNC milling and to make the sides of the neck and fretboard flush with each other.

That’s why the shoulders vary so much between each neck.