dr purple
Member
hey if i were to take out the standard tuners from a 2004 sg standard i own and swap them out for schallers or sperzel locking tuners, would there be screw holes from where the klusions where previously?
tuner changes
- Thread starter dr purple
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Arranger
New Member
Just jumping in here-
I'm looking at a 2005 SG Standard and it has those "Green Key" tuners. They look like stamped shells and I wonder how nice they really are. I'm gathering that some are pleased with the stock tuners, and some not.
Thanks for any comments you have.
I'm looking at a 2005 SG Standard and it has those "Green Key" tuners. They look like stamped shells and I wonder how nice they really are. I'm gathering that some are pleased with the stock tuners, and some not.
Thanks for any comments you have.
whiteSG
New Member
Dr. Purple and Mr. Arranger...
Of course, opinions of the quality of the stock tuners are subjective, but I'd suggest that there are many musicians who never think to change them out and make nice noises with them.
I'm not convinced that replacing the stock tuners would knock that much value off a recently manufactured SG (IMHO) if they were quality tuners and the installation was done correctly, if you were to resell. As far as the screw holes showing, wouldn't they only show if you're staring at the back of the headstock?
I'd say check it out. There are other things to consider and obsess on
such as pickups, vibrolas, etc.
If you're not happy with the stock tuners, there are a number of options the gang here can suggest. Either way, it's win-win.
Now, get to work!! (And post pics!)
Of course, opinions of the quality of the stock tuners are subjective, but I'd suggest that there are many musicians who never think to change them out and make nice noises with them.
I'm not convinced that replacing the stock tuners would knock that much value off a recently manufactured SG (IMHO) if they were quality tuners and the installation was done correctly, if you were to resell. As far as the screw holes showing, wouldn't they only show if you're staring at the back of the headstock?
I'd say check it out. There are other things to consider and obsess on
such as pickups, vibrolas, etc.If you're not happy with the stock tuners, there are a number of options the gang here can suggest. Either way, it's win-win.
Now, get to work!! (And post pics!)
Dezavala
Member
[quote author=Arranger link=topic=4127.msg64859#msg64859 date=1131141968]
Just jumping in here-
I'm looking at a 2005 SG Standard and it has those "Green Key" tuners. They look like stamped shells and I wonder how nice they really are. I'm gathering that some are pleased with the stock tuners, and some not.
Thanks for any comments you have.
[/quote]
I've never heard n e thing bad about the green keys... i just don't like the way they look...
Just jumping in here-
I'm looking at a 2005 SG Standard and it has those "Green Key" tuners. They look like stamped shells and I wonder how nice they really are. I'm gathering that some are pleased with the stock tuners, and some not.
Thanks for any comments you have.
[/quote]
I've never heard n e thing bad about the green keys... i just don't like the way they look...
We get a lot of tuner questions....
There are to big groups of tuners - those with threaded bushings, and those with push in bushings.
Threaded bushings were introduced by Grover (or at least they were the first success with them). What they do is two things. First and foremost, they allow the bushing to remain perfectly centered on the shaft and ring gear. This reduces binding to near zero levels. The other thing is it allows for a more "sealed" design, where the tuner is really sort of all sealed up from where it exits at the front of the peghead (where the string goes on) all the way to the ring gear, worm gear, and button shaft. Most of these tuners have a cast frame, which may also include a cast cover as part of it, or, a stamped on cover that attaches to it. Either way... its about the same, as the big thing is the threaded bushing, and how it allows for precise alignment.
Older press fit bushings need to be installed more carefully. If you dont have the shaft perfectly centered in the bushing, or if the bushing is the least little bit cocked, or if it was deformed while being pressed in... you're gonna get binding, and its gonna be harder to keep in tune. Taken to a extreme degree... 3 on a plate press fit tuners are the bad for guitar.... except the old Fender 6 on a plate... which are terrible! Les Pauls (current) use a "vintage" style press fit bushing tuner, and being individual tuners, are not quite as bad, but in reality, the threaded bushing tuners on the SG's and other Gibsons are in fact smoother and nearly completely free of any binding. On my two SG's and two ES-333's, all of the tuners are quite nearly perfectly smooth. Can't say as much for Lester Chester... its not nearly as smooth. Similarly, my Adamas with Ping threaded bushing tuners is smooth as glass. Tele's and Strats with Kluson copy tuners with press fit bushings are not nearly as nice. Vic got a Tele with Schaller tuners from me. Those are threaded bushings, and again, totally smooth. My Tacoma mandolin has 4 on a plate press fit tuners... and YIKES!!! terrible tuning there, just hard to get 4 holes in wood to perfectly line up with 4 shafts and keep all 4 bushings perfect as they go in.
So I think you'll find threaded bushing tuners, even cheapies, are usually better than "better grade" press fit bushings, unless GREAT care is taken to fit them properly, perfectly centered, with bushings pressed in perfectly "true" to the peghead and tuner shaft. The press fits do have that vintage look, but really, the modern ones are a better design for the job they do.
And as always... its your own taste that really matters. Your axe, your dough, your tuning headaches... your decision.
There are to big groups of tuners - those with threaded bushings, and those with push in bushings.
Threaded bushings were introduced by Grover (or at least they were the first success with them). What they do is two things. First and foremost, they allow the bushing to remain perfectly centered on the shaft and ring gear. This reduces binding to near zero levels. The other thing is it allows for a more "sealed" design, where the tuner is really sort of all sealed up from where it exits at the front of the peghead (where the string goes on) all the way to the ring gear, worm gear, and button shaft. Most of these tuners have a cast frame, which may also include a cast cover as part of it, or, a stamped on cover that attaches to it. Either way... its about the same, as the big thing is the threaded bushing, and how it allows for precise alignment.
Older press fit bushings need to be installed more carefully. If you dont have the shaft perfectly centered in the bushing, or if the bushing is the least little bit cocked, or if it was deformed while being pressed in... you're gonna get binding, and its gonna be harder to keep in tune. Taken to a extreme degree... 3 on a plate press fit tuners are the bad for guitar.... except the old Fender 6 on a plate... which are terrible! Les Pauls (current) use a "vintage" style press fit bushing tuner, and being individual tuners, are not quite as bad, but in reality, the threaded bushing tuners on the SG's and other Gibsons are in fact smoother and nearly completely free of any binding. On my two SG's and two ES-333's, all of the tuners are quite nearly perfectly smooth. Can't say as much for Lester Chester... its not nearly as smooth. Similarly, my Adamas with Ping threaded bushing tuners is smooth as glass. Tele's and Strats with Kluson copy tuners with press fit bushings are not nearly as nice. Vic got a Tele with Schaller tuners from me. Those are threaded bushings, and again, totally smooth. My Tacoma mandolin has 4 on a plate press fit tuners... and YIKES!!! terrible tuning there, just hard to get 4 holes in wood to perfectly line up with 4 shafts and keep all 4 bushings perfect as they go in.
So I think you'll find threaded bushing tuners, even cheapies, are usually better than "better grade" press fit bushings, unless GREAT care is taken to fit them properly, perfectly centered, with bushings pressed in perfectly "true" to the peghead and tuner shaft. The press fits do have that vintage look, but really, the modern ones are a better design for the job they do.
And as always... its your own taste that really matters. Your axe, your dough, your tuning headaches... your decision.
What do y'all think about this....
Maybe we should add to the TUNING Sticky or create another sticky that features a list of tuners that will perfectly fit our Classics, Specials, and Standards (heck, why not every variety of SG) without the need for drilling. This seems a common concern (a repeat offender, if you will). People are going to change their tuners for any number of reasons, like aesthetics, for replacement, or for function, whether we agree that they should or not. Since this site is the most comprehensive source of SG Info on the web, I think it would make sense to provide that for our fellow members.
Give The People What They Want!
(It's the only way to make 'em love us.) :)
Maybe we should add to the TUNING Sticky or create another sticky that features a list of tuners that will perfectly fit our Classics, Specials, and Standards (heck, why not every variety of SG) without the need for drilling. This seems a common concern (a repeat offender, if you will). People are going to change their tuners for any number of reasons, like aesthetics, for replacement, or for function, whether we agree that they should or not. Since this site is the most comprehensive source of SG Info on the web, I think it would make sense to provide that for our fellow members.
Give The People What They Want!
(It's the only way to make 'em love us.) :)
