dbb
Well-Known Member
Didn't Dorian post an article about neck flex and tone on the old forum?
Neck Flex
- Thread starter Dreamscape
- Start date
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One interesting Norlin feature is the 3-piece laminated mahogany neck that is a part of my ’78 SG Standard. The main advantage of a well made laminated neck is that it will be more stable and less prone to warpage. A laminated neck doesn’t necessarily have to be stiffer, but in my case I’ve never experienced any problems with flex. Playability and tone is very good.
Maybe this lamination business was a way to cut production costs, but at the same time I think they actually improved the construction.
Am I just lucky? -What’s the opinion of others playing laminated mahogany necks?
Maybe this lamination business was a way to cut production costs, but at the same time I think they actually improved the construction.
Am I just lucky? -What’s the opinion of others playing laminated mahogany necks?
I understand that this flex is apparently just part of some SG's - and I guest that's what is is.. I am not trying to create this flex on purpose, I was just wondering if there was anything (i.e. heavier guage strings) that could alleviate it - I would certainly prefer not to have flex. Learning to work with it seems to be the answer. It certainly is worth it. Really lovin this thing!
slappy2x
Member
One thing I did notice concerning SG's and their necks.....no guitar I've ever owned was so responsive to a truss rod adjustment! I wanted to reduce a touch of the relief in my neck, tightened the truss rod a quarter turn, and the next thing I know I had a hump! I damn near shi*!!! An eight of a turn in the other direction dialed my relief in perfectly.
Alex_SG
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Angry Tele
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you could sell/trade it for a 70s Tribute. You said you dont care much for p90s anyway, the 70s has mini-humbuckers and a quarter sawn maple neck which makes it as sturdy as my Tele necks.
its also a beefier neck, almost 1 " at the 12th fret.
Problem solved.
Col Mustard
Well-Known Member
@mikemac... I don't think the guage of string has much effect on flex. heavier strings will bow your neck more, lighter strings will bow it less. the guitar needs to be set up for the guage you find most comfortable and stable. then it's a balance between the truss rod and the strings, as slappy says.
so you're right to 'learn to work with it...' it's not difficult, just different if you're used to Fenders or Ibanez etc. and it's definitely worth it. Many of us on these boards have other guitars we play, including Fenders and Epiphones and other brands. But we all have an affinity for the SG, or we'd be hanging out on the site devoted to the prototype,
the Les Paul.
me, I like the way my SG comes alive in my hands and sings or growls or screams as needed. mine doesn't hum.
so you're right to 'learn to work with it...' it's not difficult, just different if you're used to Fenders or Ibanez etc. and it's definitely worth it. Many of us on these boards have other guitars we play, including Fenders and Epiphones and other brands. But we all have an affinity for the SG, or we'd be hanging out on the site devoted to the prototype,
the Les Paul.
me, I like the way my SG comes alive in my hands and sings or growls or screams as needed. mine doesn't hum.
dbb
Well-Known Member
The one that showed that even the peghead and such is part of the overall pattern of vibration?
It was a while ago.
Hammer
Well-Known Member
The flex is coming from the neck itself not the neck joint & its up & down flex. Its not a problem for me as the guitar holds its tune well, just an observation after coming from Fenders.
I actually got a bit of a shock when I brought this guitar as to the size of the body/neck, I purchased it used & I had this funny feeling that it was a fake because it was so toylike but the serial numbers all checked out.
I had never seen a SG 60's tribute with the natural colour in lefty in Australia they are all Black or Red & I think the Natural makes the guitar look even smaller. I don't use the SG that much as the P90's don't really suit the style of music I play, but it is still a cool guitar & I love the neck even if it is a flexyflyer
The joint does play into it, but most of it is from the carve/profile of the neck. 60s style necks are thinner and flex more. Maybe this diagram will help you visualize the difference:
My experience is that neck flex is a case-by-case thing based on each guitar, but there's also some overall points tied to neck wood, neck depth, and construction.
Maple necks tend to flex less.
Since I don't play out right now, the main thing I notice with my guitars is that around the change of seasons (or temperature), there's a +/- of 1/64" in action, and .001-.002" in relief.
I used to have a thin-necked import Tele that was like a Gumby neck, played fine but moved a lot. I currently have a leftover project guitar that also has a thin neck, but never moves. It's a cheapo (and maple), so no consideration was made for wood quality when it was made, it's just one of those things.
For the OP Dreamscape, and also mikemac, there might be some issues with the guitars settling in, since they're both recent builds. Since wood is an organic material, it develops a 'memory' over time. It's one of those truisms of guitar voodoo. So it could take some time. I have the same issue with my recently acquired '10 LP Special, it doesn't flex (yet) but she's not played in.
Also, if you love your new guitar(s), you'll love em more as they get played, they get better!
Maple necks tend to flex less.
Since I don't play out right now, the main thing I notice with my guitars is that around the change of seasons (or temperature), there's a +/- of 1/64" in action, and .001-.002" in relief.
I used to have a thin-necked import Tele that was like a Gumby neck, played fine but moved a lot. I currently have a leftover project guitar that also has a thin neck, but never moves. It's a cheapo (and maple), so no consideration was made for wood quality when it was made, it's just one of those things.
For the OP Dreamscape, and also mikemac, there might be some issues with the guitars settling in, since they're both recent builds. Since wood is an organic material, it develops a 'memory' over time. It's one of those truisms of guitar voodoo. So it could take some time. I have the same issue with my recently acquired '10 LP Special, it doesn't flex (yet) but she's not played in.
Also, if you love your new guitar(s), you'll love em more as they get played, they get better!
Relic61
Well-Known Member
I will reluctantly take the roll of the parent who warns of the immanent loss of an eye if you get a BB gun when I say that many a Gibson neck has been snapped by intentionally bending the neck. Whether for effect or for fun, after a neck snaps it is irrelevant what the reason for bending & flexing on the neck was. You could even be doing the same trick with bending that neck for years then one day...$hizzle my Nizzle!! you have 2 pieces where there once was one.
I'm not saying dont have fun & fully understand how sometimes we can feel trapped or denied of such string bends on a fixed bridge Gibson but be forwarned...Its all fun n games until somebody looses an eye. Then you can be like that eye patch dude on TV that wakes up in a roadside ditch. Dont end up in a roadside ditch..switch to a tremolo.
I'm not saying dont have fun & fully understand how sometimes we can feel trapped or denied of such string bends on a fixed bridge Gibson but be forwarned...Its all fun n games until somebody looses an eye. Then you can be like that eye patch dude on TV that wakes up in a roadside ditch. Dont end up in a roadside ditch..switch to a tremolo.
Shh! You're gonna ruin it for luthiers and repairtechs everywhere if guys stop abusing their SGs !
dbb
Well-Known Member
Simple...stop over-flexing your SG neck!
It's like the guy that hits himself over the head with the hammer so that it'll feel better when he stops.
It's like the guy that hits himself over the head with the hammer so that it'll feel better when he stops.
dbb and Alex_SG -- Sorry to be late to this thread. I believe these are the web pages you remember, or at least these are the web pages that I like to watch. An acoustics group at Penn State did a nice set of measurements of flexing of the neck and body of a few guitars at their resonance frequencies. The main page is here
Dr. Russell's Research - Acoustics of Guitars
The visuals on the Epiphone Coronet are particularly interesting
Modal Analysis of an Electric Guitar
Evidently the neck plays a big role in the resonances of the instrument, at least for a solid body guitar. The resonances of an acoustic guitar are more complex.
The website shows magnified vibrational patterns, but they don't tell you which instruments are softest against deflection. The flexure of a stressed instrument is not related in a simple way to its resonances. I don't recall a web site showing the flexures of guitars that were stressed under various loads. I'm not sure I would want to take on such a project myself either :-)
Dr. Russell's Research - Acoustics of Guitars
The visuals on the Epiphone Coronet are particularly interesting
Modal Analysis of an Electric Guitar
Evidently the neck plays a big role in the resonances of the instrument, at least for a solid body guitar. The resonances of an acoustic guitar are more complex.
The website shows magnified vibrational patterns, but they don't tell you which instruments are softest against deflection. The flexure of a stressed instrument is not related in a simple way to its resonances. I don't recall a web site showing the flexures of guitars that were stressed under various loads. I'm not sure I would want to take on such a project myself either :-)
I think that people in this thread are talking about 2 separate things...I posted about the natural neck flex (and movement) that occurs with weather changes, not deliberate bending. It looks like people here are talking about both.
dbb
Well-Known Member
OH...that weather-related movement can be adjusted with the truss rod, if needed.
I thought we were talking about forced neck bending....
I thought we were talking about forced neck bending....
Both of my G400s have remarkably stable necks ! I have changed strings gauges on the 98 several times, without apparent change in the neck relief since my initial set up . My Gibbo Faded Special seems marginally less rigid, though perhaps slightly more resonant, particularly in the low and midrange . Biddlin;>)/
Angry Tele
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i thought neck flex referred to necks that change pitch with just the slightest touch. Ive had sgs that if you just lay your hand on the neck it changed pitch.
any guitar neck can be bent down a half step, whether its good for the neck or not most would say its ok on a Fender (maple) but not a Gibson (mahagony).
Brad Paisley tells a story of Redd Volkaert bending a 1950 Broadcatser neck down a whole step like it was nothing.
and Slash tells the story of his LP neck snapping off after 1 too many fancy neck bends.
I used to bend my SG neck all the time but back then I didnt give a **** about guitars.
any guitar neck can be bent down a half step, whether its good for the neck or not most would say its ok on a Fender (maple) but not a Gibson (mahagony).
Brad Paisley tells a story of Redd Volkaert bending a 1950 Broadcatser neck down a whole step like it was nothing.
and Slash tells the story of his LP neck snapping off after 1 too many fancy neck bends.
I used to bend my SG neck all the time but back then I didnt give a **** about guitars.
